1
00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:28,830
[Music]

2
00:00:33,030 --> 00:00:30,470
so

3
00:00:33,750 --> 00:00:33,040
friends and fellow curious humans and

4
00:00:36,310 --> 00:00:33,760
welcome to

5
00:00:37,510 --> 00:00:36,320
ask an astrobiologist the show that

6
00:00:39,830 --> 00:00:37,520
celebrates the science

7
00:00:42,229 --> 00:00:39,840
and celebrates the scientists involved

8
00:00:43,190 --> 00:00:42,239
in our quest to understand the nature of

9
00:00:45,350 --> 00:00:43,200
life

10
00:00:47,270 --> 00:00:45,360
i'm your host graham lau also known as

11
00:00:49,350 --> 00:00:47,280
the cosmobiologist

12
00:00:52,389 --> 00:00:49,360
and we're brought to you by seganet.org

13
00:00:54,549 --> 00:00:52,399
and the nasa astrobiology program

14
00:00:56,069 --> 00:00:54,559
and today we have a really fun special

15
00:00:58,950 --> 00:00:56,079
episode for all of you

16
00:01:01,270 --> 00:00:58,960
that's going to focus on the history and

17
00:01:02,150 --> 00:01:01,280
the impacts of the astrobiology graduate

18
00:01:05,350 --> 00:01:02,160
conference

19
00:01:07,670 --> 00:01:05,360
or ab grad con i myself when i was a

20
00:01:09,190 --> 00:01:07,680
graduate student was very involved in ab

21
00:01:12,149 --> 00:01:09,200
grad con conferences

22
00:01:15,190 --> 00:01:12,159
i first attended in 2012 i helped to

23
00:01:16,870 --> 00:01:15,200
organize the conference in 2014 and 2015

24
00:01:18,789 --> 00:01:16,880
and as my shirt says even though it's

25
00:01:21,030 --> 00:01:18,799
hard to see in 2016

26
00:01:22,390 --> 00:01:21,040
i was one of the two lead organizers for

27
00:01:24,310 --> 00:01:22,400
this conference

28
00:01:25,590 --> 00:01:24,320
and what is appgradcon you might be

29
00:01:27,350 --> 00:01:25,600
wondering it's

30
00:01:29,190 --> 00:01:27,360
a conference specifically targeting

31
00:01:31,190 --> 00:01:29,200
early career scientists

32
00:01:33,109 --> 00:01:31,200
graduate students primarily but also

33
00:01:36,310 --> 00:01:33,119
some undergraduates and some graduates

34
00:01:37,270 --> 00:01:36,320
are postdocs to come together and share

35
00:01:39,590 --> 00:01:37,280
their research

36
00:01:41,109 --> 00:01:39,600
share their interests but also to

37
00:01:43,030 --> 00:01:41,119
network to learn more about

38
00:01:44,789 --> 00:01:43,040
each other from the various places

39
00:01:46,230 --> 00:01:44,799
around the world they come from

40
00:01:47,830 --> 00:01:46,240
and the different kinds of research

41
00:01:50,230 --> 00:01:47,840
projects they have going on

42
00:01:51,670 --> 00:01:50,240
to learn about collaboration and even

43
00:01:53,109 --> 00:01:51,680
for myself to learn about science

44
00:01:55,429 --> 00:01:53,119
communication that's where

45
00:01:57,749 --> 00:01:55,439
i really realized at appgradcom that i

46
00:01:59,749 --> 00:01:57,759
wanted to learn how to share my science

47
00:02:02,389 --> 00:01:59,759
not just with other geologists and other

48
00:02:04,230 --> 00:02:02,399
biochemists both astrophysicists and

49
00:02:06,149 --> 00:02:04,240
oceanographers and philosophers and

50
00:02:07,109 --> 00:02:06,159
engineers and everyone else i possibly

51
00:02:08,710 --> 00:02:07,119
could

52
00:02:10,150 --> 00:02:08,720
uh and so we're super excited to have a

53
00:02:13,030 --> 00:02:10,160
very special episode

54
00:02:14,630 --> 00:02:13,040
of ask an astrobiologist focusing on ab

55
00:02:16,869 --> 00:02:14,640
grad con today for you

56
00:02:18,390 --> 00:02:16,879
uh we know that things have been really

57
00:02:20,949 --> 00:02:18,400
hard during this pandemic for

58
00:02:23,030 --> 00:02:20,959
everyone and it's absolutely okay for us

59
00:02:24,630 --> 00:02:23,040
to take a moment and reflect on that

60
00:02:26,630 --> 00:02:24,640
and and to work together to make things

61
00:02:28,309 --> 00:02:26,640
better it has been really hard on early

62
00:02:30,309 --> 00:02:28,319
career scientists who

63
00:02:31,910 --> 00:02:30,319
need to travel to these meetings and

64
00:02:32,550 --> 00:02:31,920
need to collaborate and meet other

65
00:02:34,309 --> 00:02:32,560
people

66
00:02:36,229 --> 00:02:34,319
to build their professional networks and

67
00:02:37,350 --> 00:02:36,239
prepare for their futures as scientists

68
00:02:40,070 --> 00:02:37,360
and engineers and

69
00:02:41,830 --> 00:02:40,080
in other realms they wish to pursue and

70
00:02:44,150 --> 00:02:41,840
you might know that ad grad con

71
00:02:46,070 --> 00:02:44,160
2020 was postponed this year

72
00:02:47,750 --> 00:02:46,080
unfortunately due to the pandemic

73
00:02:50,790 --> 00:02:47,760
uh it has been rescheduled though so

74
00:02:52,550 --> 00:02:50,800
keep an eye out at abgradcon.org

75
00:02:55,190 --> 00:02:52,560
uh for next year's conference taking

76
00:02:55,990 --> 00:02:55,200
place from 14 to 17 september in tokyo

77
00:02:57,430 --> 00:02:56,000
japan

78
00:02:59,190 --> 00:02:57,440
we're really looking forward to ab grad

79
00:03:01,830 --> 00:02:59,200
con 2021

80
00:03:03,430 --> 00:03:01,840
uh and then for today is going to be a

81
00:03:04,470 --> 00:03:03,440
really special episode like i said so

82
00:03:06,630 --> 00:03:04,480
instead of doing

83
00:03:08,149 --> 00:03:06,640
our photo contest we normally do we

84
00:03:08,869 --> 00:03:08,159
wanted to share really quickly a few

85
00:03:10,869 --> 00:03:08,879
memories

86
00:03:12,390 --> 00:03:10,879
from twitter that a few past attendees

87
00:03:15,589 --> 00:03:12,400
shared with us

88
00:03:17,990 --> 00:03:15,599
first off demetra autry shared a pic

89
00:03:19,589 --> 00:03:18,000
on twitter of a picture from abradcom

90
00:03:21,350 --> 00:03:19,599
2008

91
00:03:23,589 --> 00:03:21,360
uh which seems like a long time ago but

92
00:03:25,110 --> 00:03:23,599
it's been a launch pad for many people

93
00:03:26,789 --> 00:03:25,120
uh including some of the researchers who

94
00:03:28,949 --> 00:03:26,799
were joining me today uh who were

95
00:03:30,710 --> 00:03:28,959
talking about ab grad khan

96
00:03:32,550 --> 00:03:30,720
and sanjoy saam the leader of blue

97
00:03:35,589 --> 00:03:32,560
marble space he also

98
00:03:37,910 --> 00:03:35,599
led abrad khan in 2009 and he said that

99
00:03:39,830 --> 00:03:37,920
ab grad khan is where he realized that

100
00:03:41,110 --> 00:03:39,840
a collective of humans working together

101
00:03:43,190 --> 00:03:41,120
towards a goal

102
00:03:45,350 --> 00:03:43,200
is much more productive than the sum of

103
00:03:48,229 --> 00:03:45,360
the individual parts

104
00:03:49,910 --> 00:03:48,239
mary sabuda also mentioned that it's a

105
00:03:51,830 --> 00:03:49,920
non-judgmental environment at

106
00:03:53,270 --> 00:03:51,840
grad con and that she made many friends

107
00:03:55,270 --> 00:03:53,280
in the field from doing that and

108
00:03:57,190 --> 00:03:55,280
i agree entirely it's how i built most

109
00:04:00,070 --> 00:03:57,200
of my professional network

110
00:04:01,509 --> 00:04:00,080
and monica vidalia said it was beyond

111
00:04:03,990 --> 00:04:01,519
exciting to discover just how

112
00:04:05,509 --> 00:04:04,000
interdisciplinary astrobiology really is

113
00:04:07,429 --> 00:04:05,519
thanks to ab grad khan

114
00:04:08,550 --> 00:04:07,439
she learned so much in just a few short

115
00:04:09,750 --> 00:04:08,560
days and created not just new

116
00:04:11,910 --> 00:04:09,760
collaborations

117
00:04:13,270 --> 00:04:11,920
but new friendships and i think once we

118
00:04:14,710 --> 00:04:13,280
introduce our guests here you'll hear a

119
00:04:16,069 --> 00:04:14,720
lot of that as well

120
00:04:17,830 --> 00:04:16,079
it's definitely a place for building

121
00:04:19,430 --> 00:04:17,840
networks for building and maintaining

122
00:04:21,030 --> 00:04:19,440
friendships and connections

123
00:04:22,550 --> 00:04:21,040
throughout the realm for early career

124
00:04:25,270 --> 00:04:22,560
scientists

125
00:04:26,790 --> 00:04:25,280
and also as always a huge thanks to

126
00:04:28,870 --> 00:04:26,800
those of you out there who

127
00:04:30,150 --> 00:04:28,880
who share information about our show who

128
00:04:32,310 --> 00:04:30,160
share the graphics

129
00:04:34,070 --> 00:04:32,320
who reach out to our guests who get

130
00:04:35,749 --> 00:04:34,080
involved on twitter and facebook and

131
00:04:37,110 --> 00:04:35,759
instagram and linkedin and tick tock and

132
00:04:37,670 --> 00:04:37,120
read it and all these other places that

133
00:04:41,590 --> 00:04:37,680
you

134
00:04:43,670 --> 00:04:41,600
online in the conversation

135
00:04:45,189 --> 00:04:43,680
we especially want to say thanks to

136
00:04:47,990 --> 00:04:45,199
brooke caruthers

137
00:04:49,430 --> 00:04:48,000
rabia abdul rasheed and mike lee and

138
00:04:51,510 --> 00:04:49,440
also i want to give a really special

139
00:04:53,830 --> 00:04:51,520
shout out to sarah treadwell

140
00:04:55,670 --> 00:04:53,840
who was a young scientist program intern

141
00:04:57,030 --> 00:04:55,680
this summer with me at blue marble space

142
00:04:58,629 --> 00:04:57,040
institute of science

143
00:05:00,710 --> 00:04:58,639
and is now going to be not only a

144
00:05:02,710 --> 00:05:00,720
visiting scholar working with me

145
00:05:04,390 --> 00:05:02,720
but is also running my teleprompter in

146
00:05:06,710 --> 00:05:04,400
the background for our show

147
00:05:08,710 --> 00:05:06,720
uh she's going to help uh monitoring all

148
00:05:10,150 --> 00:05:08,720
of your questions on segon net and on

149
00:05:12,150 --> 00:05:10,160
the facebook chat

150
00:05:13,830 --> 00:05:12,160
so if you see sarah just know that she's

151
00:05:15,510 --> 00:05:13,840
the one who then is sharing all of this

152
00:05:18,550 --> 00:05:15,520
awesome information with me

153
00:05:21,189 --> 00:05:18,560
and helping you connect with our guests

154
00:05:22,230 --> 00:05:21,199
so all of that mouthful said i'm so

155
00:05:25,189 --> 00:05:22,240
happy to welcome

156
00:05:27,029 --> 00:05:25,199
all of our guests all doctors we have

157
00:05:30,270 --> 00:05:27,039
lena nowak joining us

158
00:05:31,430 --> 00:05:30,280
mark neveaux sandra celia strom and

159
00:05:33,430 --> 00:05:31,440
vladostamenkovic

160
00:05:36,830 --> 00:05:33,440
all joining us so everyone thank you so

161
00:05:41,430 --> 00:05:38,469
astrobiologist

162
00:05:42,710 --> 00:05:41,440
thanks graham hi rob hey good morning

163
00:05:43,189 --> 00:05:42,720
awesome and like i said this is going to

164
00:05:45,110 --> 00:05:43,199
be a fun

165
00:05:46,230 --> 00:05:45,120
episode and kind of new for us we've

166
00:05:48,550 --> 00:05:46,240
never had such a large

167
00:05:50,710 --> 00:05:48,560
group of people together on the show and

168
00:05:52,870 --> 00:05:50,720
so i think what i'll start doing

169
00:05:54,710 --> 00:05:52,880
is just to ask each of you a little bit

170
00:05:56,629 --> 00:05:54,720
about you know what got you into the

171
00:05:58,550 --> 00:05:56,639
sciences what your journey has been

172
00:06:00,710 --> 00:05:58,560
a lot of our viewers are early career

173
00:06:02,230 --> 00:06:00,720
scientists they want to know how can

174
00:06:03,990 --> 00:06:02,240
they become researchers how can they

175
00:06:05,270 --> 00:06:04,000
become astrobiologists

176
00:06:07,749 --> 00:06:05,280
uh and so if each of you could just

177
00:06:09,110 --> 00:06:07,759
briefly share with us uh your pathway i

178
00:06:10,950 --> 00:06:09,120
think i think i'll start with lena

179
00:06:12,550 --> 00:06:10,960
if you don't mind uh sharing your

180
00:06:14,150 --> 00:06:12,560
pathway into the sciences and what you

181
00:06:16,070 --> 00:06:14,160
currently do

182
00:06:17,590 --> 00:06:16,080
yeah sure i'm happy to say hello

183
00:06:19,990 --> 00:06:17,600
everyone yeah i'm lena

184
00:06:20,710 --> 00:06:20,000
i'm a planetary geophysical modeler from

185
00:06:22,070 --> 00:06:20,720
germany

186
00:06:23,990 --> 00:06:22,080
so for me it's actually late in the

187
00:06:25,590 --> 00:06:24,000
evening now and even dark outside

188
00:06:28,070 --> 00:06:25,600
already

189
00:06:29,990 --> 00:06:28,080
actually how i got there i actually had

190
00:06:31,350 --> 00:06:30,000
nothing to do with astrobiology in the

191
00:06:33,749 --> 00:06:31,360
beginning when i was studying

192
00:06:35,590 --> 00:06:33,759
at university i was studying mathematics

193
00:06:36,629 --> 00:06:35,600
so something that's rather dry compared

194
00:06:39,830 --> 00:06:36,639
to what i do now

195
00:06:41,189 --> 00:06:39,840
to be honest but then as a i was looking

196
00:06:42,870 --> 00:06:41,199
for a phd

197
00:06:45,029 --> 00:06:42,880
topic i wanted to have something more

198
00:06:47,270 --> 00:06:45,039
applied so i wanted to still

199
00:06:49,110 --> 00:06:47,280
do the mathematical numerical

200
00:06:50,150 --> 00:06:49,120
computational background that i built up

201
00:06:52,390 --> 00:06:50,160
at university

202
00:06:54,469 --> 00:06:52,400
but i wanted to apply it to topics that

203
00:06:56,150 --> 00:06:54,479
i find interesting and

204
00:06:58,309 --> 00:06:56,160
when i realized that there's a german

205
00:06:59,350 --> 00:06:58,319
aerospace center with an institute on

206
00:07:02,469 --> 00:06:59,360
plenty research

207
00:07:04,469 --> 00:07:02,479
actually next door of my university of

208
00:07:06,390 --> 00:07:04,479
course i asked there first for a phd and

209
00:07:07,749 --> 00:07:06,400
i was very lucky that they were exactly

210
00:07:10,629 --> 00:07:07,759
looking for someone like me

211
00:07:11,909 --> 00:07:10,639
at that time and so for me it was really

212
00:07:13,990 --> 00:07:11,919
lucky to get into

213
00:07:16,070 --> 00:07:14,000
to this whole field of planetary

214
00:07:18,150 --> 00:07:16,080
sciences this way

215
00:07:19,749 --> 00:07:18,160
and i was actually part of the larger

216
00:07:22,230 --> 00:07:19,759
netgroup

217
00:07:24,150 --> 00:07:22,240
focusing on astrobiology topics so

218
00:07:26,150 --> 00:07:24,160
specifically on planetary habitability

219
00:07:28,309 --> 00:07:26,160
and evolution

220
00:07:30,390 --> 00:07:28,319
and after a couple of years when i was

221
00:07:32,309 --> 00:07:30,400
looking for a postdoc position there was

222
00:07:33,670 --> 00:07:32,319
yet another network it was actually in

223
00:07:35,589 --> 00:07:33,680
belgium at the time

224
00:07:37,990 --> 00:07:35,599
looking again on planetary evolution

225
00:07:41,110 --> 00:07:38,000
habitability aspects so it was a

226
00:07:43,029 --> 00:07:41,120
perfect match for me and i had some

227
00:07:44,629 --> 00:07:43,039
five really nice years in belgium and

228
00:07:46,150 --> 00:07:44,639
brussets at the royal observatory of

229
00:07:47,990 --> 00:07:46,160
belgium there

230
00:07:50,070 --> 00:07:48,000
and yeah a few years back i was quite

231
00:07:51,749 --> 00:07:50,080
lucky to get a junior professorship

232
00:07:53,270 --> 00:07:51,759
in germany which is actually like an

233
00:07:56,150 --> 00:07:53,280
assistant professorship

234
00:07:57,670 --> 00:07:56,160
position in the us and so i'm building

235
00:07:59,670 --> 00:07:57,680
up my my group now

236
00:08:01,110 --> 00:07:59,680
on modelling's interior of planets

237
00:08:02,469 --> 00:08:01,120
outgassing and understanding the

238
00:08:04,309 --> 00:08:02,479
coupling between the interior and the

239
00:08:05,510 --> 00:08:04,319
atmosphere essentially

240
00:08:07,510 --> 00:08:05,520
that's awesome yeah and it's good to

241
00:08:08,629 --> 00:08:07,520
point out that we use different terms

242
00:08:09,830 --> 00:08:08,639
across the world for some of these

243
00:08:11,430 --> 00:08:09,840
different positions and

244
00:08:13,270 --> 00:08:11,440
i even discovered this past year that

245
00:08:15,270 --> 00:08:13,280
the word graduate student itself isn't

246
00:08:16,469 --> 00:08:15,280
isn't necessarily the same thing

247
00:08:18,230 --> 00:08:16,479
in lots of different places which is

248
00:08:19,670 --> 00:08:18,240
really interesting to so when you are

249
00:08:21,189 --> 00:08:19,680
speaking to people across the globe

250
00:08:22,950 --> 00:08:21,199
remember that we do use different terms

251
00:08:25,589 --> 00:08:22,960
for some of these positions

252
00:08:27,110 --> 00:08:25,599
uh how about mark novo next uh what was

253
00:08:28,390 --> 00:08:27,120
your pathway mark into your current

254
00:08:31,510 --> 00:08:28,400
career

255
00:08:32,149 --> 00:08:31,520
yeah so hi everyone i'm mark um i i've

256
00:08:34,070 --> 00:08:32,159
been

257
00:08:35,670 --> 00:08:34,080
uh super interested in astrobiology ever

258
00:08:37,509 --> 00:08:35,680
since i was a teenager really but

259
00:08:40,389 --> 00:08:37,519
i learned i could do this for a living

260
00:08:42,630 --> 00:08:40,399
about 10 years ago maybe 11 years ago

261
00:08:43,750 --> 00:08:42,640
as an intern at nasa's goddard space

262
00:08:45,350 --> 00:08:43,760
flight center in the suburbs of

263
00:08:47,750 --> 00:08:45,360
washington dc

264
00:08:49,030 --> 00:08:47,760
back then that was i'm french and so i

265
00:08:51,829 --> 00:08:49,040
was studying in france

266
00:08:53,030 --> 00:08:51,839
aerospace engineering and i came to

267
00:08:55,509 --> 00:08:53,040
goddard to

268
00:08:57,350 --> 00:08:55,519
to intern as an aerospace engineer but

269
00:08:59,910 --> 00:08:57,360
then i discovered the science side

270
00:09:01,670 --> 00:08:59,920
and that was love at first sight i i

271
00:09:04,070 --> 00:09:01,680
applied for phd programs

272
00:09:05,910 --> 00:09:04,080
in the us did my phd research at arizona

273
00:09:08,870 --> 00:09:05,920
state university

274
00:09:10,710 --> 00:09:08,880
and after that i came back to the dc

275
00:09:12,070 --> 00:09:10,720
area although that was kind of uh kind

276
00:09:13,509 --> 00:09:12,080
of random but i worked at nasa

277
00:09:16,630 --> 00:09:13,519
headquarters

278
00:09:19,030 --> 00:09:16,640
in the astrobiology program um until

279
00:09:19,750 --> 00:09:19,040
about two years ago where i joined nasa

280
00:09:22,070 --> 00:09:19,760
goddard

281
00:09:23,350 --> 00:09:22,080
um and since i've been i've been working

282
00:09:25,590 --> 00:09:23,360
there it's great place

283
00:09:26,630 --> 00:09:25,600
um and my favorite destination to search

284
00:09:28,949 --> 00:09:26,640
for life as uh

285
00:09:30,070 --> 00:09:28,959
is the icy worlds of the solar system

286
00:09:32,790 --> 00:09:30,080
and the oceans that lie

287
00:09:33,910 --> 00:09:32,800
beneath awesome yeah and there's there's

288
00:09:35,509 --> 00:09:33,920
much to explore

289
00:09:36,870 --> 00:09:35,519
in our solar system and beyond for

290
00:09:38,550 --> 00:09:36,880
planetary formation but also for the

291
00:09:39,910 --> 00:09:38,560
formation of icy worlds and

292
00:09:41,670 --> 00:09:39,920
understanding you know these oceans and

293
00:09:43,430 --> 00:09:41,680
whether or not there could be life there

294
00:09:45,509 --> 00:09:43,440
uh it's huge for astrobiology so i'm

295
00:09:47,750 --> 00:09:45,519
sure we'll have a lot of questions from

296
00:09:49,190 --> 00:09:47,760
our audience later on in the episode

297
00:09:51,430 --> 00:09:49,200
uh about all these things that you're

298
00:09:52,949 --> 00:09:51,440
all working on uh how about sandra

299
00:09:56,310 --> 00:09:52,959
celiastrom next

300
00:09:58,949 --> 00:09:56,320
uh what what's your pathway been yeah so

301
00:09:59,829 --> 00:09:58,959
i kind of discovered astrobiology during

302
00:10:01,750 --> 00:09:59,839
high school

303
00:10:03,030 --> 00:10:01,760
and when i was looking for the internet

304
00:10:05,670 --> 00:10:03,040
on the internet then i

305
00:10:06,949 --> 00:10:05,680
and i always liked the stars and but i

306
00:10:09,590 --> 00:10:06,959
also always liked like

307
00:10:11,350 --> 00:10:09,600
fossils and ancient life and i realized

308
00:10:13,509 --> 00:10:11,360
there is actually a subject that

309
00:10:15,509 --> 00:10:13,519
combines the two subjects so it was a

310
00:10:17,509 --> 00:10:15,519
perfect subject so

311
00:10:19,509 --> 00:10:17,519
and this was also kind of around when

312
00:10:19,910 --> 00:10:19,519
they announced that they found life in

313
00:10:27,190 --> 00:10:19,920
this

314
00:10:30,310 --> 00:10:27,200
eight four zero zero one and

315
00:10:32,069 --> 00:10:30,320
and then actually then i did there was

316
00:10:35,350 --> 00:10:32,079
no real astrobiology in

317
00:10:35,990 --> 00:10:35,360
sweden so i'm in sweden so i did an

318
00:10:38,630 --> 00:10:36,000
undergrad

319
00:10:40,550 --> 00:10:38,640
actually in engineering biology but

320
00:10:41,590 --> 00:10:40,560
actually as i was doing my master's

321
00:10:43,670 --> 00:10:41,600
thesis

322
00:10:45,590 --> 00:10:43,680
there was this guy that called himself

323
00:10:46,710 --> 00:10:45,600
the first astrobiologist in sweden and

324
00:10:48,870 --> 00:10:46,720
he was on tv

325
00:10:51,110 --> 00:10:48,880
commenting the landing of i think it was

326
00:10:53,509 --> 00:10:51,120
the murrow verse or something

327
00:10:55,509 --> 00:10:53,519
and and i actually sent him an email and

328
00:10:57,269 --> 00:10:55,519
got a master's three faces through him

329
00:10:58,710 --> 00:10:57,279
so you can actually get a master's

330
00:11:01,269 --> 00:10:58,720
through history

331
00:11:02,630 --> 00:11:01,279
through like actually seeing something

332
00:11:05,110 --> 00:11:02,640
through tv and then

333
00:11:06,790 --> 00:11:05,120
and then i did my master's and i

334
00:11:07,350 --> 00:11:06,800
actually did my master's at the place

335
00:11:10,310 --> 00:11:07,360
i'm actually

336
00:11:11,509 --> 00:11:10,320
working now this is sweden's largest

337
00:11:15,430 --> 00:11:11,519
research institute

338
00:11:17,670 --> 00:11:15,440
rice and and and then we applied for

339
00:11:20,870 --> 00:11:17,680
money for phd so i continued

340
00:11:23,430 --> 00:11:20,880
and i did a phd in so i have a phd in

341
00:11:26,069 --> 00:11:23,440
neochemistry so i'm studying organics

342
00:11:26,870 --> 00:11:26,079
in rocks usually doing like in situ

343
00:11:29,430 --> 00:11:26,880
measurements

344
00:11:30,069 --> 00:11:29,440
trying to localize organics to specific

345
00:11:34,310 --> 00:11:30,079
features

346
00:11:37,269 --> 00:11:34,320
in rocks including margin meteorites

347
00:11:39,190 --> 00:11:37,279
and this and after i finished my phd i

348
00:11:40,630 --> 00:11:39,200
got a permanent position as a research

349
00:11:43,190 --> 00:11:40,640
scientist that is rice

350
00:11:44,150 --> 00:11:43,200
and currently my biggest project maybe

351
00:11:46,949 --> 00:11:44,160
is i just

352
00:11:47,670 --> 00:11:46,959
was selected to become a return sample

353
00:11:50,949 --> 00:11:47,680
scientist

354
00:11:53,110 --> 00:11:50,959
on the mars 2020 rover

355
00:11:55,030 --> 00:11:53,120
so i'm going to be part of the team to

356
00:11:58,150 --> 00:11:55,040
select the

357
00:11:59,190 --> 00:11:58,160
samples for uh for the mars 2020 rover

358
00:12:00,790 --> 00:11:59,200
to be drilled

359
00:12:02,629 --> 00:12:00,800
among other signs all the other

360
00:12:05,269 --> 00:12:02,639
scientists working on the excellent

361
00:12:07,509 --> 00:12:05,279
scientists working on mars 2020. so

362
00:12:09,110 --> 00:12:07,519
that's so well set on my path we

363
00:12:09,990 --> 00:12:09,120
definitely need awesome geochemistry too

364
00:12:11,750 --> 00:12:10,000
and we want to get

365
00:12:14,310 --> 00:12:11,760
the best samples back we possibly can

366
00:12:16,310 --> 00:12:14,320
from mars uh sample return is like a

367
00:12:17,670 --> 00:12:16,320
holy grail right in space sciences and

368
00:12:19,670 --> 00:12:17,680
astrobiology

369
00:12:21,269 --> 00:12:19,680
um you know so we might know that like

370
00:12:22,829 --> 00:12:21,279
right now uh hayabusa2

371
00:12:25,350 --> 00:12:22,839
is on its way home with some asteroidal

372
00:12:27,590 --> 00:12:25,360
materials uh we have osiris-rex on its

373
00:12:29,269 --> 00:12:27,600
way home with some asteroidal materials

374
00:12:30,949 --> 00:12:29,279
uh but we haven't returned any samples

375
00:12:32,949 --> 00:12:30,959
from the surface of mars yet and so

376
00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:32,959
that'll be a huge undertaking for us to

377
00:12:37,190 --> 00:12:34,160
have happen

378
00:12:38,310 --> 00:12:37,200
um how about vladostamenkovitch how

379
00:12:40,150 --> 00:12:38,320
about uh what was your

380
00:12:42,389 --> 00:12:40,160
your pathway in the sciences towards

381
00:12:44,150 --> 00:12:42,399
your career you currently have

382
00:12:45,670 --> 00:12:44,160
so i think first good morning good

383
00:12:46,790 --> 00:12:45,680
afternoon good evening everybody all

384
00:12:49,509 --> 00:12:46,800
over the world

385
00:12:50,310 --> 00:12:49,519
um nice to be here so my path started

386
00:12:52,790 --> 00:12:50,320
really young

387
00:12:53,990 --> 00:12:52,800
i think mainly with next generation uh

388
00:12:55,750 --> 00:12:54,000
meaning star trek

389
00:12:57,110 --> 00:12:55,760
i think diana troy and captain picard

390
00:12:59,829 --> 00:12:57,120
can alert me in

391
00:13:00,550 --> 00:12:59,839
um and you know for me and that's

392
00:13:03,829 --> 00:13:00,560
actually

393
00:13:05,829 --> 00:13:03,839
quite real i think star trek has been uh

394
00:13:07,990 --> 00:13:05,839
influencing me very early on because you

395
00:13:10,870 --> 00:13:08,000
know they don't really care about

396
00:13:12,150 --> 00:13:10,880
you know catalyzing or looking at like

397
00:13:13,670 --> 00:13:12,160
stars they don't really want to find

398
00:13:14,389 --> 00:13:13,680
life in the universe explore life in the

399
00:13:16,310 --> 00:13:14,399
universe

400
00:13:17,910 --> 00:13:16,320
so i became very very early just

401
00:13:19,670 --> 00:13:17,920
fascinated by life

402
00:13:21,670 --> 00:13:19,680
and i try to find my way into that in

403
00:13:23,990 --> 00:13:21,680
switzerland where i grew up

404
00:13:25,269 --> 00:13:24,000
and uh there was nothing really focusing

405
00:13:27,269 --> 00:13:25,279
on astrobiology but

406
00:13:28,550 --> 00:13:27,279
i started studying physics at the eta

407
00:13:29,990 --> 00:13:28,560
and zurich theoretical physics and

408
00:13:32,230 --> 00:13:30,000
mathematics

409
00:13:34,550 --> 00:13:32,240
and in parallel i there was a space

410
00:13:36,550 --> 00:13:34,560
biology institute and

411
00:13:37,990 --> 00:13:36,560
with some really good friends of mine we

412
00:13:40,389 --> 00:13:38,000
went straight into there and

413
00:13:41,430 --> 00:13:40,399
started doing experiments on uh on zero

414
00:13:44,150 --> 00:13:41,440
g planes

415
00:13:46,790 --> 00:13:44,160
and then later on i became the pi of

416
00:13:48,949 --> 00:13:46,800
sending action experiment to the iss

417
00:13:49,829 --> 00:13:48,959
while i was still studying and on a

418
00:13:51,829 --> 00:13:49,839
russian

419
00:13:53,910 --> 00:13:51,839
satellite the the latter one which was

420
00:13:56,389 --> 00:13:53,920
actually the first one exploded

421
00:13:57,670 --> 00:13:56,399
uh but we went luckily fortunate to the

422
00:13:59,189 --> 00:13:57,680
iss

423
00:14:01,269 --> 00:13:59,199
and then i searched more for the path

424
00:14:01,990 --> 00:14:01,279
how to get really to how to use my

425
00:14:04,949 --> 00:14:02,000
capabilities

426
00:14:06,949 --> 00:14:04,959
to explore life in the universe and i

427
00:14:08,710 --> 00:14:06,959
took it then to a phd at the same place

428
00:14:09,670 --> 00:14:08,720
that lena did a phd in the german

429
00:14:12,949 --> 00:14:09,680
aerospace center

430
00:14:14,150 --> 00:14:12,959
in berlin and i used my physics

431
00:14:17,269 --> 00:14:14,160
knowledge to

432
00:14:17,750 --> 00:14:17,279
expand into geophysics uh high pressure

433
00:14:20,150 --> 00:14:17,760
physics

434
00:14:21,910 --> 00:14:20,160
especially um and planet revolution

435
00:14:25,030 --> 00:14:21,920
models and so i worked a lot

436
00:14:26,069 --> 00:14:25,040
on plant revolution interior um and high

437
00:14:29,350 --> 00:14:26,079
pressure physics

438
00:14:31,829 --> 00:14:29,360
what it means for life on exoplanets um

439
00:14:33,430 --> 00:14:31,839
mainly and also on mars and i was kind

440
00:14:35,350 --> 00:14:33,440
of between exoplanets and mars

441
00:14:37,910 --> 00:14:35,360
because as i always say i don't like to

442
00:14:39,910 --> 00:14:37,920
discriminate against anything or anyone

443
00:14:41,110 --> 00:14:39,920
including planets and planetary objects

444
00:14:43,350 --> 00:14:41,120
they're all cool

445
00:14:45,509 --> 00:14:43,360
and we should have a large diversity of

446
00:14:47,509 --> 00:14:45,519
them that's the most beautiful thing

447
00:14:48,550 --> 00:14:47,519
so and when you do physics you can

448
00:14:51,110 --> 00:14:48,560
generalize

449
00:14:51,910 --> 00:14:51,120
i think linda can very much identify

450
00:14:53,910 --> 00:14:51,920
that as well

451
00:14:55,269 --> 00:14:53,920
because when you do you know look at

452
00:14:56,230 --> 00:14:55,279
pressure and temperature it's just

453
00:14:58,389 --> 00:14:56,240
different different

454
00:14:59,430 --> 00:14:58,399
objects but it's still generalizable to

455
00:15:02,550 --> 00:14:59,440
everything

456
00:15:05,189 --> 00:15:02,560
um and then after my phd i

457
00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:05,199
uh flew out to the us i did a i was a

458
00:15:09,670 --> 00:15:06,240
swiss national

459
00:15:10,230 --> 00:15:09,680
science fellow at mit uh whereas many

460
00:15:12,470 --> 00:15:10,240
working

461
00:15:13,670 --> 00:15:12,480
on exoplanet habitability and interior

462
00:15:16,310 --> 00:15:13,680
revolution

463
00:15:17,030 --> 00:15:16,320
and then i became a simon's fellow on

464
00:15:20,389 --> 00:15:17,040
the origin of

465
00:15:21,110 --> 00:15:20,399
life which took me to caltech and from

466
00:15:23,509 --> 00:15:21,120
caltech

467
00:15:25,509 --> 00:15:23,519
i transferred and joined jpl the jet

468
00:15:28,629 --> 00:15:25,519
propulsion laboratory

469
00:15:30,230 --> 00:15:28,639
to uh work there and i'm actually

470
00:15:32,230 --> 00:15:30,240
mainly focused on building a lab over

471
00:15:34,389 --> 00:15:32,240
there i built the lab called the fire

472
00:15:37,590 --> 00:15:34,399
lab standing for plant hydrology

473
00:15:39,509 --> 00:15:37,600
and uh and resource exploration but

474
00:15:40,949 --> 00:15:39,519
it was mainly astrobiology lab so i've

475
00:15:43,509 --> 00:15:40,959
been mainly working there on

476
00:15:44,470 --> 00:15:43,519
subsurface habitability particularly of

477
00:15:46,550 --> 00:15:44,480
mars

478
00:15:48,629 --> 00:15:46,560
and i was doing the science but in the

479
00:15:51,189 --> 00:15:48,639
same time also looking at the technology

480
00:15:52,230 --> 00:15:51,199
and i was leading a development of an

481
00:15:54,949 --> 00:15:52,240
instrument

482
00:15:56,870 --> 00:15:54,959
called thor standing for transmissive h2

483
00:15:59,990 --> 00:15:56,880
reconnaissance to look for water

484
00:16:02,230 --> 00:16:00,000
in the deep subset of this mars um and

485
00:16:03,110 --> 00:16:02,240
you know right now so just taking steps

486
00:16:05,990 --> 00:16:03,120
right now i actually

487
00:16:06,470 --> 00:16:06,000
left jpl a few weeks ago and i'm right

488
00:16:08,949 --> 00:16:06,480
now

489
00:16:10,710 --> 00:16:08,959
um senior director and the principal

490
00:16:14,470 --> 00:16:10,720
technologist for isru

491
00:16:16,790 --> 00:16:14,480
at blue origin isru stands for in-situ

492
00:16:19,670 --> 00:16:16,800
resource utilization

493
00:16:21,430 --> 00:16:19,680
and blue origin is one of the you know

494
00:16:22,150 --> 00:16:21,440
leading companies worldwide and trying

495
00:16:25,749 --> 00:16:22,160
to get us

496
00:16:28,389 --> 00:16:25,759
humans more frequently to space and

497
00:16:29,590 --> 00:16:28,399
make space exploration more feasible and

498
00:16:32,550 --> 00:16:29,600
more common

499
00:16:33,910 --> 00:16:32,560
and um i'm still you know the reason why

500
00:16:36,790 --> 00:16:33,920
germany did that is because

501
00:16:37,829 --> 00:16:36,800
it's still astrology for me uh you know

502
00:16:40,629 --> 00:16:37,839
for one

503
00:16:42,470 --> 00:16:40,639
it's called food that's for the bugs and

504
00:16:43,030 --> 00:16:42,480
the other things are resources the same

505
00:16:44,949 --> 00:16:43,040
thing

506
00:16:47,430 --> 00:16:44,959
so much of my research has been focused

507
00:16:49,670 --> 00:16:47,440
on resources and food for life

508
00:16:51,590 --> 00:16:49,680
uh and sub-surface exploration because i

509
00:16:53,269 --> 00:16:51,600
think that life in the universe

510
00:16:55,269 --> 00:16:53,279
especially in our solar system if it's

511
00:16:56,949 --> 00:16:55,279
out there it's all in the subsurface

512
00:16:59,670 --> 00:16:56,959
and that's the place to really look for

513
00:17:01,350 --> 00:16:59,680
it today but i think also in the past

514
00:17:03,509 --> 00:17:01,360
i think the subsurface has been the best

515
00:17:05,110 --> 00:17:03,519
place for life and

516
00:17:07,350 --> 00:17:05,120
the reason why i joined blue origin is

517
00:17:08,789 --> 00:17:07,360
because i think we're all doing so much

518
00:17:11,669 --> 00:17:08,799
exciting things

519
00:17:12,470 --> 00:17:11,679
for many different objects and if we

520
00:17:14,549 --> 00:17:12,480
continue

521
00:17:16,710 --> 00:17:14,559
in the status quo we've done so far it

522
00:17:18,630 --> 00:17:16,720
will take us about a few thousand years

523
00:17:21,669 --> 00:17:18,640
to have explored only a fraction of

524
00:17:23,750 --> 00:17:21,679
those and everything will be theoretical

525
00:17:26,309 --> 00:17:23,760
and if you really want to go to you know

526
00:17:28,470 --> 00:17:26,319
go to mars go to series go to

527
00:17:30,630 --> 00:17:28,480
triton go to europa go to all those

528
00:17:31,990 --> 00:17:30,640
places and do many experiments to really

529
00:17:34,870 --> 00:17:32,000
have conclusive evidence

530
00:17:36,310 --> 00:17:34,880
of life or non-life we need to get much

531
00:17:38,390 --> 00:17:36,320
more frequent through space

532
00:17:40,789 --> 00:17:38,400
we can continue the way we've been doing

533
00:17:43,270 --> 00:17:40,799
it and blue origin in that way

534
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:43,280
is really pushing for that and having

535
00:17:45,590 --> 00:17:44,480
the opportunity now to build a

536
00:17:47,029 --> 00:17:45,600
department for

537
00:17:48,710 --> 00:17:47,039
ins you know in-situ resource

538
00:17:51,029 --> 00:17:48,720
exploration the solar system

539
00:17:52,470 --> 00:17:51,039
i want to help us all to get them more

540
00:17:54,390 --> 00:17:52,480
frequently get data

541
00:17:56,549 --> 00:17:54,400
so we don't have to fight for place on

542
00:17:58,950 --> 00:17:56,559
space missions but we have the breadth

543
00:18:00,470 --> 00:17:58,960
of everything and then we can really

544
00:18:04,150 --> 00:18:00,480
discuss scientifically

545
00:18:05,590 --> 00:18:04,160
and yeah smile altogether

546
00:18:07,830 --> 00:18:05,600
it's a really interesting time right now

547
00:18:09,590 --> 00:18:07,840
right with with new space with all these

548
00:18:12,230 --> 00:18:09,600
private space companies coming up

549
00:18:13,510 --> 00:18:12,240
not only opening access for launch uh

550
00:18:14,470 --> 00:18:13,520
through a lot of new rockets that are

551
00:18:15,990 --> 00:18:14,480
being developed

552
00:18:17,669 --> 00:18:16,000
but also opening access for new

553
00:18:19,270 --> 00:18:17,679
satellite technologies new earth

554
00:18:20,630 --> 00:18:19,280
observation technologies

555
00:18:22,230 --> 00:18:20,640
and yeah a lot of like you mentioned

556
00:18:23,830 --> 00:18:22,240
with blue origin and other companies who

557
00:18:25,669 --> 00:18:23,840
want to also go out and

558
00:18:27,510 --> 00:18:25,679
and figure out how do we put humans on

559
00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:27,520
the moon how do we put humans on mars

560
00:18:30,630 --> 00:18:28,640
how will they live there

561
00:18:32,870 --> 00:18:30,640
and how can we use resources there and

562
00:18:33,669 --> 00:18:32,880
there is a huge astrobiology component

563
00:18:35,190 --> 00:18:33,679
as well

564
00:18:36,950 --> 00:18:35,200
from a lot of these groups who also want

565
00:18:38,710 --> 00:18:36,960
to want to help us understand

566
00:18:40,470 --> 00:18:38,720
the science of what's going on out there

567
00:18:41,990 --> 00:18:40,480
in the cosmos and i feel like amongst

568
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:42,000
the five of us we have a good mix here

569
00:18:45,430 --> 00:18:42,480
we have

570
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:45,440
research institutions government

571
00:18:49,350 --> 00:18:48,000
agencies private companies a non-profit

572
00:18:51,430 --> 00:18:49,360
that we should get together and start

573
00:18:53,590 --> 00:18:51,440
something i think

574
00:18:54,789 --> 00:18:53,600
but um but thank you so much all of you

575
00:18:56,789 --> 00:18:54,799
uh for that

576
00:18:57,830 --> 00:18:56,799
uh a lot of our folks watching at home

577
00:18:59,669 --> 00:18:57,840
right now

578
00:19:01,430 --> 00:18:59,679
in our audience are undergraduate

579
00:19:03,669 --> 00:19:01,440
students or graduate students they are

580
00:19:06,470 --> 00:19:03,679
interested in how they can be involved

581
00:19:08,549 --> 00:19:06,480
and how they can become astrobiologists

582
00:19:10,710 --> 00:19:08,559
and the things that they can do

583
00:19:12,870 --> 00:19:10,720
in their own careers to advance into

584
00:19:15,350 --> 00:19:12,880
awesome careers like all of you have

585
00:19:16,310 --> 00:19:15,360
um but we are here to talk about the

586
00:19:18,870 --> 00:19:16,320
impacts of

587
00:19:19,830 --> 00:19:18,880
early career endeavors specifically at

588
00:19:21,590 --> 00:19:19,840
grad con

589
00:19:23,830 --> 00:19:21,600
and what it's meant for all of us uh i

590
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:23,840
mentioned earlier i was at four ab grad

591
00:19:28,070 --> 00:19:25,200
cons and and was

592
00:19:29,029 --> 00:19:28,080
a co-lead organizer for one of them uh

593
00:19:30,789 --> 00:19:29,039
we'd love to hear

594
00:19:33,270 --> 00:19:30,799
from all of you what your experiences

595
00:19:36,390 --> 00:19:33,280
with ab grad khan were

596
00:19:37,350 --> 00:19:36,400
how the conference impacted your careers

597
00:19:38,870 --> 00:19:37,360
and so i think i'll go through the same

598
00:19:40,710 --> 00:19:38,880
order again lena if you wouldn't mind

599
00:19:42,630 --> 00:19:40,720
just telling us your experience

600
00:19:45,430 --> 00:19:42,640
in app grad con and what it's meant for

601
00:19:47,990 --> 00:19:45,440
you in your career

602
00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:48,000
yeah sure so i was actually at uh three

603
00:19:52,549 --> 00:19:50,080
epicons um

604
00:19:54,150 --> 00:19:52,559
actually before mostly before you've

605
00:19:55,350 --> 00:19:54,160
actually went to april console if he is

606
00:19:58,470 --> 00:19:55,360
so old right now

607
00:20:00,789 --> 00:19:58,480
after your introduction worked um

608
00:20:01,669 --> 00:20:00,799
so interestingly from the three upgrade

609
00:20:03,510 --> 00:20:01,679
coins that i had

610
00:20:04,710 --> 00:20:03,520
two were actually quite special because

611
00:20:07,830 --> 00:20:04,720
one was the

612
00:20:09,590 --> 00:20:07,840
so far only european version

613
00:20:11,510 --> 00:20:09,600
i still hope there's going to be another

614
00:20:12,870 --> 00:20:11,520
european aquacon coming up and in that

615
00:20:15,510 --> 00:20:12,880
couple of years

616
00:20:17,270 --> 00:20:15,520
the other one was a canadian one and in

617
00:20:18,070 --> 00:20:17,280
montreal it was also really a nice

618
00:20:21,669 --> 00:20:18,080
experience

619
00:20:25,350 --> 00:20:21,679
and i was also in la um for one of the

620
00:20:27,830 --> 00:20:25,360
um epcot cons and actually in the one

621
00:20:29,270 --> 00:20:27,840
in canada with what happened was that we

622
00:20:31,190 --> 00:20:29,280
were actually lucky to get uh

623
00:20:33,430 --> 00:20:31,200
european funding to send i think it was

624
00:20:34,870 --> 00:20:33,440
like 10 european students to be able to

625
00:20:37,590 --> 00:20:34,880
go there as well and

626
00:20:38,710 --> 00:20:37,600
we all really really enjoyed it some of

627
00:20:40,390 --> 00:20:38,720
us had been there before

628
00:20:41,990 --> 00:20:40,400
for some of them it was the first time

629
00:20:44,070 --> 00:20:42,000
and the the

630
00:20:46,310 --> 00:20:44,080
spirit of epcretcon was so different

631
00:20:49,110 --> 00:20:46,320
from anything that we had from from

632
00:20:51,909 --> 00:20:49,120
national or even european organizations

633
00:20:53,909 --> 00:20:51,919
that we were exposed to at that time

634
00:20:56,149 --> 00:20:53,919
we really said like it's such a shame we

635
00:20:57,029 --> 00:20:56,159
really we really need to be more

636
00:20:59,590 --> 00:20:57,039
frequently at

637
00:21:01,270 --> 00:20:59,600
meetings live at corn but there's always

638
00:21:02,230 --> 00:21:01,280
this issue it's very difficult to find

639
00:21:05,510 --> 00:21:02,240
funding for

640
00:21:07,669 --> 00:21:05,520
non-us participants to actually join and

641
00:21:09,430 --> 00:21:07,679
i tried for a couple of years to get

642
00:21:11,909 --> 00:21:09,440
some european funding

643
00:21:12,870 --> 00:21:11,919
and so we realized that we actually need

644
00:21:16,230 --> 00:21:12,880
something

645
00:21:18,710 --> 00:21:16,240
quite similar in europe so

646
00:21:19,830 --> 00:21:18,720
because we really enjoyed the aquacon so

647
00:21:21,909 --> 00:21:19,840
much because we

648
00:21:23,990 --> 00:21:21,919
treasured our experience that we had at

649
00:21:25,909 --> 00:21:24,000
epcot condom we wanted to make it open

650
00:21:27,110 --> 00:21:25,919
to as many european participants as

651
00:21:29,430 --> 00:21:27,120
possible

652
00:21:30,390 --> 00:21:29,440
uh we actually started a couple of years

653
00:21:31,750 --> 00:21:30,400
later

654
00:21:33,909 --> 00:21:31,760
based from from the european

655
00:21:36,630 --> 00:21:33,919
astrobiology network association

656
00:21:38,230 --> 00:21:36,640
and a european version and we

657
00:21:41,270 --> 00:21:38,240
shamelessly use the name

658
00:21:43,590 --> 00:21:41,280
grady actually to show everyone who our

659
00:21:45,190 --> 00:21:43,600
big brother is

660
00:21:46,710 --> 00:21:45,200
so since a couple of years this is

661
00:21:49,029 --> 00:21:46,720
actually it's actually becoming

662
00:21:49,750 --> 00:21:49,039
more and more um enthusiastic that

663
00:21:52,149 --> 00:21:49,760
people like

664
00:21:53,669 --> 00:21:52,159
a wood sufi table is a president since a

665
00:21:55,750 --> 00:21:53,679
couple of years and she really managed

666
00:21:57,350 --> 00:21:55,760
to bring it to a completely new level

667
00:21:58,950 --> 00:21:57,360
and i'm really happy to see it still

668
00:22:01,750 --> 00:21:58,960
going on and really shows

669
00:22:02,310 --> 00:22:01,760
that everyone who's has ever been at an

670
00:22:04,630 --> 00:22:02,320
upgrade

671
00:22:06,390 --> 00:22:04,640
or epcot con meeting always stays the

672
00:22:09,510 --> 00:22:06,400
same yeah you have to go again

673
00:22:10,950 --> 00:22:09,520
it's everyone has to go clearly

674
00:22:13,110 --> 00:22:10,960
yeah it's very addictive right it makes

675
00:22:14,710 --> 00:22:13,120
us want to go back yeah i think ab grad

676
00:22:15,750 --> 00:22:14,720
e this year was also unfortunately

677
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:15,760
postponed

678
00:22:20,070 --> 00:22:17,600
um because again you know this pandemic

679
00:22:21,669 --> 00:22:20,080
is is around the world it's impacting us

680
00:22:25,350 --> 00:22:21,679
uh but hopefully for everyone in europe

681
00:22:27,110 --> 00:22:25,360
keep your eyes out for appgrati 2021

682
00:22:29,029 --> 00:22:27,120
yes actually this year it was even

683
00:22:31,430 --> 00:22:29,039
virtual so there was a one day online

684
00:22:32,870 --> 00:22:31,440
meeting uh where also epcon for example

685
00:22:35,029 --> 00:22:32,880
was represented

686
00:22:35,909 --> 00:22:35,039
um and probably next year it will be the

687
00:22:39,110 --> 00:22:35,919
same

688
00:22:40,710 --> 00:22:39,120
yeah it's quite likely yeah uh martin

689
00:22:43,590 --> 00:22:40,720
neveaux how about you next uh what was

690
00:22:46,950 --> 00:22:43,600
your experience in ab grad con

691
00:22:48,070 --> 00:22:46,960
so i i went to three as well in 2014 15

692
00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:48,080
and 16.

693
00:22:54,390 --> 00:22:51,360
uh the first one was in troy new york

694
00:22:55,990 --> 00:22:54,400
uh the second in madison in wisconsin

695
00:22:59,510 --> 00:22:56,000
and the third and boulder and colorado

696
00:23:02,310 --> 00:22:59,520
so all three in the us

697
00:23:03,029 --> 00:23:02,320
and i would say i would definitely agree

698
00:23:05,909 --> 00:23:03,039
with the

699
00:23:06,630 --> 00:23:05,919
the what lena said about it being

700
00:23:09,669 --> 00:23:06,640
low-key

701
00:23:09,990 --> 00:23:09,679
and the point is to is to meet people

702
00:23:17,750 --> 00:23:10,000
and

703
00:23:20,230 --> 00:23:17,760
sounds too formal collaboration so

704
00:23:21,510 --> 00:23:20,240
you cannot make friends um and it's cool

705
00:23:22,549 --> 00:23:21,520
i mean these are gonna be the people who

706
00:23:23,909 --> 00:23:22,559
are gonna be working with your whole

707
00:23:25,430 --> 00:23:23,919
career right you can you can go to a

708
00:23:26,950 --> 00:23:25,440
normal conference and

709
00:23:28,390 --> 00:23:26,960
and meet the big shots and so on but

710
00:23:28,789 --> 00:23:28,400
they they won't be here in 10 years i

711
00:23:32,390 --> 00:23:28,799
guess

712
00:23:34,870 --> 00:23:32,400
i mean maybe but uh so so it's

713
00:23:35,430 --> 00:23:34,880
how cool to be able to to you know meet

714
00:23:37,430 --> 00:23:35,440
your

715
00:23:39,029 --> 00:23:37,440
future colleagues into an informal

716
00:23:40,549 --> 00:23:39,039
setting and and really

717
00:23:42,710 --> 00:23:40,559
um i think this is one of the reasons

718
00:23:44,630 --> 00:23:42,720
why it's it's so fun to do extra biology

719
00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:44,640
you you get to work with people

720
00:23:48,950 --> 00:23:46,000
you like for the most part and you can

721
00:23:51,669 --> 00:23:48,960
choose them um but uh but the the

722
00:23:52,549 --> 00:23:51,679
you know the the spirit of um of

723
00:23:55,110 --> 00:23:52,559
collaboration

724
00:23:57,430 --> 00:23:55,120
and uh and and friendship is uh is

725
00:23:59,350 --> 00:23:57,440
really built on on events like this

726
00:24:01,909 --> 00:23:59,360
um so i've definitely felt that i had

727
00:24:05,269 --> 00:24:01,919
upgradecon that that's the first thing

728
00:24:07,830 --> 00:24:05,279
um i scientifically

729
00:24:09,269 --> 00:24:07,840
uh the the first year i participated in

730
00:24:12,549 --> 00:24:09,279
2014

731
00:24:13,510 --> 00:24:12,559
uh i also applied to participate in uh

732
00:24:15,350 --> 00:24:13,520
in a proposal

733
00:24:16,789 --> 00:24:15,360
writing workshop that was just a couple

734
00:24:19,990 --> 00:24:16,799
days before the conference and

735
00:24:20,950 --> 00:24:20,000
it was it was optional and uh that was

736
00:24:22,470 --> 00:24:20,960
that was great

737
00:24:24,470 --> 00:24:22,480
we were in a retreat you know on the

738
00:24:26,710 --> 00:24:24,480
side of the lake uh kind of uh

739
00:24:28,149 --> 00:24:26,720
isolated from the world it was great

740
00:24:31,510 --> 00:24:28,159
landscape and also

741
00:24:33,430 --> 00:24:31,520
quite time to to work on science ideas

742
00:24:35,110 --> 00:24:33,440
um and you know you have to work with

743
00:24:36,230 --> 00:24:35,120
others there people come from the very

744
00:24:37,990 --> 00:24:36,240
different backgrounds so you kind of

745
00:24:41,110 --> 00:24:38,000
have to broaden your ideas

746
00:24:42,149 --> 00:24:41,120
um and i and i did um i had never

747
00:24:45,190 --> 00:24:42,159
thought about

748
00:24:48,470 --> 00:24:45,200
titan and carbon cycling and so on

749
00:24:51,190 --> 00:24:48,480
and uh and that's where i got the first

750
00:24:52,789 --> 00:24:51,200
uh inspiration to to kind of go into

751
00:24:54,390 --> 00:24:52,799
that area of research

752
00:24:56,149 --> 00:24:54,400
and eventually after a couple of

753
00:24:59,269 --> 00:24:56,159
proposals for post docs and so on

754
00:24:59,990 --> 00:24:59,279
um i was fine to do this this work uh

755
00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:00,000
through a through

756
00:25:03,909 --> 00:25:03,440
a full-blown nasa grant um during my

757
00:25:05,510 --> 00:25:03,919
first

758
00:25:07,029 --> 00:25:05,520
postdoc and that just never really

759
00:25:09,269 --> 00:25:07,039
thought it would turn out that way but

760
00:25:11,110 --> 00:25:09,279
it came from from my great home that's

761
00:25:12,789 --> 00:25:11,120
awesome it's amazing how those

762
00:25:13,830 --> 00:25:12,799
things can get sparked that way and i

763
00:25:15,430 --> 00:25:13,840
remember this we used to call it the

764
00:25:18,310 --> 00:25:15,440
research focus group

765
00:25:19,190 --> 00:25:18,320
uh and i was there too in 2014 and 2015

766
00:25:21,029 --> 00:25:19,200
with you

767
00:25:23,110 --> 00:25:21,039
uh and now they changed the name it

768
00:25:26,070 --> 00:25:23,120
sounds cooler now now it's called power

769
00:25:27,909 --> 00:25:26,080
uh it's the proposal writing retreat uh

770
00:25:29,269 --> 00:25:27,919
but with every ab grad con

771
00:25:31,590 --> 00:25:29,279
for those watching who haven't been to

772
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:31,600
one with every ab grad con it's a

773
00:25:34,870 --> 00:25:32,880
week-long conference

774
00:25:36,230 --> 00:25:34,880
but usually either just before that week

775
00:25:36,710 --> 00:25:36,240
or at the very end of that week there's

776
00:25:39,510 --> 00:25:36,720
a one

777
00:25:41,029 --> 00:25:39,520
or two day long retreat where you can

778
00:25:43,909 --> 00:25:41,039
get together with your peers

779
00:25:45,510 --> 00:25:43,919
and write grant proposals and learn this

780
00:25:46,070 --> 00:25:45,520
process of what it takes to actually get

781
00:25:48,070 --> 00:25:46,080
funding

782
00:25:50,630 --> 00:25:48,080
for your science together which is a

783
00:25:51,909 --> 00:25:50,640
really cool part of appgrad con

784
00:25:53,990 --> 00:25:51,919
sandra how about you what was your

785
00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:54,000
experience with abrad khan

786
00:26:00,990 --> 00:25:57,440
yeah so i went to two ipad cons

787
00:26:02,390 --> 00:26:01,000
also a long time ago so one was at this

788
00:26:06,310 --> 00:26:02,400
2008

789
00:26:07,590 --> 00:26:06,320
in santa clara um and the second one was

790
00:26:09,510 --> 00:26:07,600
the first one actually that was

791
00:26:12,230 --> 00:26:09,520
organized in europe

792
00:26:12,950 --> 00:26:12,240
in 2010 in sweden which i was part of

793
00:26:14,789 --> 00:26:12,960
the local

794
00:26:16,230 --> 00:26:14,799
organizing committee and the scientific

795
00:26:19,190 --> 00:26:16,240
committee

796
00:26:20,950 --> 00:26:19,200
and so for the first one i mean it was

797
00:26:24,149 --> 00:26:20,960
nice

798
00:26:27,350 --> 00:26:24,159
it was i mean i started my phd in 2007

799
00:26:28,950 --> 00:26:27,360
so 2008 was quite early in my phd so

800
00:26:31,350 --> 00:26:28,960
it was nice to have this and it was

801
00:26:33,830 --> 00:26:31,360
before it was in conjunction with the

802
00:26:34,470 --> 00:26:33,840
apps icon so it was a nice place you

803
00:26:36,950 --> 00:26:34,480
know where you

804
00:26:38,710 --> 00:26:36,960
got to know some people before apps icon

805
00:26:39,750 --> 00:26:38,720
to have someone you know to hang out

806
00:26:41,990 --> 00:26:39,760
with and

807
00:26:43,669 --> 00:26:42,000
and even now if i go to apps account

808
00:26:46,070 --> 00:26:43,679
later it's still like hi

809
00:26:46,950 --> 00:26:46,080
you're here again and you know so it was

810
00:26:48,870 --> 00:26:46,960
very nice and

811
00:26:50,870 --> 00:26:48,880
and i got to know those people even more

812
00:26:53,990 --> 00:26:50,880
of course when we organized those

813
00:26:55,830 --> 00:26:54,000
a lot of those were part

814
00:26:57,590 --> 00:26:55,840
helped us with the organization the

815
00:27:00,789 --> 00:26:57,600
scientific organization later

816
00:27:01,590 --> 00:27:00,799
in 2010 and of course i learned a lot

817
00:27:03,830 --> 00:27:01,600
when

818
00:27:04,630 --> 00:27:03,840
we organized the conference in sweden

819
00:27:07,909 --> 00:27:04,640
because of

820
00:27:10,870 --> 00:27:07,919
all the logistics and so just

821
00:27:13,269 --> 00:27:10,880
you know reading abstracts picking which

822
00:27:13,750 --> 00:27:13,279
abstracts to and being a session share

823
00:27:16,310 --> 00:27:13,760
you know

824
00:27:17,750 --> 00:27:16,320
you might not get these experiences you

825
00:27:19,350 --> 00:27:17,760
know later

826
00:27:21,110 --> 00:27:19,360
until later you know in a normal

827
00:27:24,870 --> 00:27:21,120
conference and then also

828
00:27:27,510 --> 00:27:24,880
i organized the field trip in

829
00:27:29,350 --> 00:27:27,520
in it so we went in it was in sweden and

830
00:27:29,830 --> 00:27:29,360
it's in the zillion impact craters it's

831
00:27:32,470 --> 00:27:29,840
a large

832
00:27:34,630 --> 00:27:32,480
impact crater so we had this bus tour

833
00:27:36,710 --> 00:27:34,640
around and i had to

834
00:27:38,870 --> 00:27:36,720
you know pick the geological sites to go

835
00:27:41,510 --> 00:27:38,880
to and you know guide around and

836
00:27:42,070 --> 00:27:41,520
this was a great experience you know and

837
00:27:44,630 --> 00:27:42,080
and i

838
00:27:46,870 --> 00:27:44,640
yes it's not like you know a real or

839
00:27:49,990 --> 00:27:46,880
like a conference with bigwigs

840
00:27:50,630 --> 00:27:50,000
or whatever it's more relaxed so you

841
00:27:54,310 --> 00:27:50,640
don't

842
00:27:55,830 --> 00:27:54,320
maybe have to be you know afraid that

843
00:27:58,630 --> 00:27:55,840
nervous that you would do something

844
00:28:01,669 --> 00:27:58,640
wrong because it's like your peers so

845
00:28:02,230 --> 00:28:01,679
and um some of the people i met i know

846
00:28:05,110 --> 00:28:02,240
at the

847
00:28:05,909 --> 00:28:05,120
2008 they later came to me for doing

848
00:28:09,669 --> 00:28:05,919
analysis

849
00:28:13,190 --> 00:28:09,679
and samples and he actually came from

850
00:28:15,669 --> 00:28:13,200
brazil to do analysis with me and

851
00:28:17,750 --> 00:28:15,679
and because of him i learned you know i

852
00:28:19,830 --> 00:28:17,760
got to know his phd student and

853
00:28:21,510 --> 00:28:19,840
she was at this synchrotron and like you

854
00:28:23,669 --> 00:28:21,520
know so it's always like this

855
00:28:25,350 --> 00:28:23,679
you know you meet these people and you

856
00:28:28,230 --> 00:28:25,360
meet their phd students and

857
00:28:29,350 --> 00:28:28,240
you know so it's it's an er you know

858
00:28:31,190 --> 00:28:29,360
it's an import

859
00:28:33,350 --> 00:28:31,200
good place to get to know people you

860
00:28:34,870 --> 00:28:33,360
know early in their careers

861
00:28:36,789 --> 00:28:34,880
absolutely yes it's how we build our

862
00:28:38,149 --> 00:28:36,799
networks and for all of us who want to

863
00:28:39,990 --> 00:28:38,159
be astrobiologists or our

864
00:28:41,830 --> 00:28:40,000
astrobiologists it's how we

865
00:28:43,110 --> 00:28:41,840
we build these networks around the world

866
00:28:43,990 --> 00:28:43,120
i know people from around the world

867
00:28:46,070 --> 00:28:44,000
because of abrad

868
00:28:47,909 --> 00:28:46,080
khan and and i think both you and mark

869
00:28:50,310 --> 00:28:47,919
made really important points there

870
00:28:52,230 --> 00:28:50,320
uh your graduate advisor and these

871
00:28:53,990 --> 00:28:52,240
senior scientists who you see in

872
00:28:56,070 --> 00:28:54,000
television shows and movies and things

873
00:28:58,549 --> 00:28:56,080
like that and you read about

874
00:28:59,990 --> 00:28:58,559
in in popular press they're not there

875
00:29:01,350 --> 00:29:00,000
it's it's the graduate students it's

876
00:29:02,549 --> 00:29:01,360
really focused on early career

877
00:29:04,789 --> 00:29:02,559
scientists

878
00:29:06,070 --> 00:29:04,799
and one thing i love is that unlike

879
00:29:07,350 --> 00:29:06,080
other conferences where you have

880
00:29:09,510 --> 00:29:07,360
different sessions and you pick and

881
00:29:12,070 --> 00:29:09,520
choose which ones fit your research

882
00:29:13,029 --> 00:29:12,080
with ab grad con everyone listens to

883
00:29:15,909 --> 00:29:13,039
every talk

884
00:29:17,350 --> 00:29:15,919
and goes and can see every poster and so

885
00:29:19,350 --> 00:29:17,360
if you're a geologist you're going to

886
00:29:20,549 --> 00:29:19,360
learn about astrophysics or biology

887
00:29:22,789 --> 00:29:20,559
if you're a chemist you're going to

888
00:29:24,710 --> 00:29:22,799
learn about science communication and

889
00:29:27,430 --> 00:29:24,720
other realms of the sciences

890
00:29:28,710 --> 00:29:27,440
and i find that to be very cool uh so

891
00:29:30,230 --> 00:29:28,720
vlada how about you what was

892
00:29:32,470 --> 00:29:30,240
what was your experience with ab grad

893
00:29:34,950 --> 00:29:32,480
con and how did it impact your career

894
00:29:36,389 --> 00:29:34,960
well i think that not much new to ad

895
00:29:38,310 --> 00:29:36,399
everything has been only said

896
00:29:39,990 --> 00:29:38,320
i realize now as well in sandra elena

897
00:29:43,029 --> 00:29:40,000
yes i'm also getting older

898
00:29:44,710 --> 00:29:43,039
my first one was also 2008 um

899
00:29:46,549 --> 00:29:44,720
and i had to actually right now look it

900
00:29:49,669 --> 00:29:46,559
up because i wasn't sure i went to my

901
00:29:52,230 --> 00:29:49,679
gmail like oh yeah 2008. and i was the

902
00:29:53,350 --> 00:29:52,240
co-leading organizer of the 2010 one the

903
00:29:56,310 --> 00:29:53,360
first one in europe

904
00:29:57,909 --> 00:29:56,320
in sweden uh and that was a really very

905
00:29:59,510 --> 00:29:57,919
um profound experience just to

906
00:30:01,510 --> 00:29:59,520
understand how to get money

907
00:30:03,190 --> 00:30:01,520
uh how to enable money to make things

908
00:30:05,590 --> 00:30:03,200
happen and the differences between the

909
00:30:09,269 --> 00:30:05,600
us and europe which are very big

910
00:30:10,950 --> 00:30:09,279
uh still and have been um and

911
00:30:14,149 --> 00:30:10,960
but you know in general what i love

912
00:30:16,710 --> 00:30:14,159
really about appreciate

913
00:30:17,669 --> 00:30:16,720
astrology is an international endeavor

914
00:30:20,070 --> 00:30:17,679
um

915
00:30:21,510 --> 00:30:20,080
it's a multi-planetal endeavor but let's

916
00:30:23,510 --> 00:30:21,520
start with the whole world

917
00:30:25,590 --> 00:30:23,520
and we you know i find it so beautiful

918
00:30:27,990 --> 00:30:25,600
we have this new generation that

919
00:30:29,430 --> 00:30:28,000
we are and everybody around us we are

920
00:30:31,190 --> 00:30:29,440
connected with all our friends and

921
00:30:33,029 --> 00:30:31,200
colleagues all over the world

922
00:30:35,350 --> 00:30:33,039
it's a huge blessing which i think

923
00:30:36,310 --> 00:30:35,360
people before us our phd advisors didn't

924
00:30:38,950 --> 00:30:36,320
really have

925
00:30:40,389 --> 00:30:38,960
they were very local or in their country

926
00:30:40,710 --> 00:30:40,399
and i think there's still a lot to be

927
00:30:43,350 --> 00:30:40,720
done

928
00:30:44,549 --> 00:30:43,360
i mean i've been now for damn eight

929
00:30:47,029 --> 00:30:44,559
years in the u.s

930
00:30:48,230 --> 00:30:47,039
and even here i realized how we're

931
00:30:50,710 --> 00:30:48,240
really isolated

932
00:30:52,710 --> 00:30:50,720
i mean you feel the atlantic big times

933
00:30:54,549 --> 00:30:52,720
between europe and the us

934
00:30:55,990 --> 00:30:54,559
and and that's ridiculous in a time

935
00:30:58,630 --> 00:30:56,000
where we deal with climate change

936
00:31:00,070 --> 00:30:58,640
global issues and and and that's what

937
00:31:02,070 --> 00:31:00,080
apricon really helps

938
00:31:04,149 --> 00:31:02,080
i think it's one of the most beautiful

939
00:31:05,750 --> 00:31:04,159
questions we address that is

940
00:31:07,750 --> 00:31:05,760
i think the most beautiful question

941
00:31:09,350 --> 00:31:07,760
anything anybody can ask

942
00:31:11,269 --> 00:31:09,360
and we're doing this with all these

943
00:31:13,990 --> 00:31:11,279
colleagues and friends

944
00:31:16,310 --> 00:31:14,000
all over the world it's really a role

945
00:31:19,029 --> 00:31:16,320
model for how the world should be

946
00:31:21,669 --> 00:31:19,039
you know and i think uh that's what i

947
00:31:25,190 --> 00:31:21,679
love about apricon it helps doing that

948
00:31:26,789 --> 00:31:25,200
um and uh i realize actually finally uh

949
00:31:29,110 --> 00:31:26,799
when we organized the first one in

950
00:31:30,710 --> 00:31:29,120
europe 2010 and i had to google this as

951
00:31:32,310 --> 00:31:30,720
well up when it was because i forgot the

952
00:31:34,950 --> 00:31:32,320
time because i'm that old

953
00:31:36,149 --> 00:31:34,960
um it was insanely an impact crater

954
00:31:38,389 --> 00:31:36,159
which was the first

955
00:31:39,269 --> 00:31:38,399
exploration point for deep subsurface

956
00:31:41,029 --> 00:31:39,279
life

957
00:31:43,350 --> 00:31:41,039
and for you know bringing this

958
00:31:45,909 --> 00:31:43,360
connection that life might be actually

959
00:31:47,029 --> 00:31:45,919
mainly in subsurface so i kind of didn't

960
00:31:49,350 --> 00:31:47,039
really get that

961
00:31:50,549 --> 00:31:49,360
uh only later and it's kind of like

962
00:31:52,710 --> 00:31:50,559
funny now knowing that

963
00:31:53,990 --> 00:31:52,720
you know rimfax is going to be on which

964
00:31:56,789 --> 00:31:54,000
is the radar on mars which

965
00:31:58,389 --> 00:31:56,799
symbol is the horse the swedish horse so

966
00:31:59,029 --> 00:31:58,399
that was the gift we all got there and

967
00:32:04,870 --> 00:31:59,039
we got the

968
00:32:06,549 --> 00:32:04,880
so yeah and and sana's surely thinking

969
00:32:09,029 --> 00:32:06,559
now no no it's different in sweden

970
00:32:11,029 --> 00:32:09,039
but we'll figure it out nope right am i

971
00:32:13,990 --> 00:32:11,039
right i hope

972
00:32:14,549 --> 00:32:14,000
what did you say that we got this little

973
00:32:16,710 --> 00:32:14,559
horse

974
00:32:18,630 --> 00:32:16,720
as a gift for everybody oh yeah yeah

975
00:32:21,190 --> 00:32:18,640
yeah yeah i still have that one yeah

976
00:32:22,549 --> 00:32:21,200
yes and that's the also for for the gpr

977
00:32:25,669 --> 00:32:22,559
on mars right now

978
00:32:29,110 --> 00:32:25,679
um so i really would encourage everybody

979
00:32:32,149 --> 00:32:29,120
um you know go to april cons uh

980
00:32:35,750 --> 00:32:32,159
get to know the people make friends

981
00:32:38,710 --> 00:32:35,760
uh be collaborative uh work together

982
00:32:39,590 --> 00:32:38,720
don't work you know it's this whole

983
00:32:41,990 --> 00:32:39,600
thing in our

984
00:32:43,269 --> 00:32:42,000
current culture about publishing papers

985
00:32:45,750 --> 00:32:43,279
working and stuff

986
00:32:47,430 --> 00:32:45,760
and you know i think sandra said it

987
00:32:48,789 --> 00:32:47,440
really well sanjo is a very wise man for

988
00:32:50,710 --> 00:32:48,799
his age

989
00:32:53,029 --> 00:32:50,720
he's gonna be laughing there but you

990
00:32:56,230 --> 00:32:53,039
know we can really do so much

991
00:32:57,430 --> 00:32:56,240
more together and it's just also so much

992
00:33:00,149 --> 00:32:57,440
more fun

993
00:33:01,509 --> 00:33:00,159
and um you know and that brings me back

994
00:33:03,110 --> 00:33:01,519
to the star trek thing

995
00:33:04,789 --> 00:33:03,120
which i always loved in star trek was

996
00:33:07,029 --> 00:33:04,799
how people work together

997
00:33:08,789 --> 00:33:07,039
and respect each other and care for each

998
00:33:10,470 --> 00:33:08,799
other and that's what i always felt with

999
00:33:13,669 --> 00:33:10,480
appreciate there is this

1000
00:33:14,549 --> 00:33:13,679
real care and curiosity and making

1001
00:33:17,350 --> 00:33:14,559
things

1002
00:33:18,310 --> 00:33:17,360
together more beautiful and bigger i

1003
00:33:19,830 --> 00:33:18,320
love that yeah

1004
00:33:21,350 --> 00:33:19,840
and you know and i'm glad that you

1005
00:33:22,549 --> 00:33:21,360
mentioned too like the international

1006
00:33:24,389 --> 00:33:22,559
component i mean

1007
00:33:26,230 --> 00:33:24,399
all five of us here are from various

1008
00:33:28,950 --> 00:33:26,240
different places around the world

1009
00:33:30,310 --> 00:33:28,960
and uh ab grad con 2021 will take place

1010
00:33:32,310 --> 00:33:30,320
in tokyo japan

1011
00:33:33,430 --> 00:33:32,320
led by doctors tony gia and kristen

1012
00:33:35,269 --> 00:33:33,440
johnson

1013
00:33:36,870 --> 00:33:35,279
uh and it's gonna be another kind of

1014
00:33:38,149 --> 00:33:36,880
international collaborative conference

1015
00:33:39,590 --> 00:33:38,159
for a lot of people from

1016
00:33:41,669 --> 00:33:39,600
especially around the pacific region to

1017
00:33:43,430 --> 00:33:41,679
come together and join abroad con and

1018
00:33:44,230 --> 00:33:43,440
during this pandemic we've noticed a lot

1019
00:33:46,630 --> 00:33:44,240
more

1020
00:33:47,750 --> 00:33:46,640
uh people coming online new voices from

1021
00:33:49,669 --> 00:33:47,760
around the globe

1022
00:33:51,509 --> 00:33:49,679
people from various countries from

1023
00:33:52,310 --> 00:33:51,519
africa and europe and asia and south

1024
00:33:53,909 --> 00:33:52,320
america

1025
00:33:56,070 --> 00:33:53,919
are also getting super involved in the

1026
00:33:58,950 --> 00:33:56,080
conversation uh with us and

1027
00:34:00,549 --> 00:33:58,960
i love seeing that so much and as i

1028
00:34:01,750 --> 00:34:00,559
mentioned earlier for me one of the big

1029
00:34:04,070 --> 00:34:01,760
things for me

1030
00:34:05,830 --> 00:34:04,080
with ab grad con was it was during ab

1031
00:34:07,430 --> 00:34:05,840
grad con that i realized that being a

1032
00:34:08,310 --> 00:34:07,440
communicator of science someone who

1033
00:34:09,669 --> 00:34:08,320
speaks

1034
00:34:11,270 --> 00:34:09,679
about the power of science and the

1035
00:34:12,310 --> 00:34:11,280
things that we learn in our place in the

1036
00:34:14,950 --> 00:34:12,320
cosmos how this

1037
00:34:16,629 --> 00:34:14,960
impacts our lives and so i'd love for

1038
00:34:17,829 --> 00:34:16,639
for any of you i'll i'll open it up now

1039
00:34:19,349 --> 00:34:17,839
to an open question

1040
00:34:21,669 --> 00:34:19,359
uh if any of you have any thoughts on

1041
00:34:23,990 --> 00:34:21,679
this uh every ab grad con

1042
00:34:24,869 --> 00:34:24,000
includes a a community engagement

1043
00:34:27,270 --> 00:34:24,879
section

1044
00:34:29,109 --> 00:34:27,280
uh some way going out to share science

1045
00:34:32,230 --> 00:34:29,119
with the public in some manner

1046
00:34:33,750 --> 00:34:32,240
uh i wonder uh how that changed for you

1047
00:34:35,909 --> 00:34:33,760
the impact of appgrad

1048
00:34:38,950 --> 00:34:35,919
con learning also how to communicate

1049
00:34:42,069 --> 00:34:40,790
well if i can say something in that

1050
00:34:44,389 --> 00:34:42,079
context i think you just

1051
00:34:45,589 --> 00:34:44,399
you know mentioned it early on we sit

1052
00:34:49,190 --> 00:34:45,599
all together in one room

1053
00:34:50,869 --> 00:34:49,200
we eat our donuts uh or depending on the

1054
00:34:52,710 --> 00:34:50,879
location maybe something else

1055
00:34:54,790 --> 00:34:52,720
uh and we listen to things that we have

1056
00:34:57,270 --> 00:34:54,800
no damn clue about you know we're

1057
00:34:58,550 --> 00:34:57,280
we're hearing things from astrophysics

1058
00:35:01,910 --> 00:34:58,560
biology

1059
00:35:02,950 --> 00:35:01,920
uh from chemistry geology so you really

1060
00:35:05,349 --> 00:35:02,960
first learn

1061
00:35:06,870 --> 00:35:05,359
to explain things simple so that

1062
00:35:08,550 --> 00:35:06,880
everybody can understand it

1063
00:35:10,470 --> 00:35:08,560
and that's really an important gift to

1064
00:35:11,270 --> 00:35:10,480
learn and then you will learn to be

1065
00:35:13,430 --> 00:35:11,280
patient

1066
00:35:14,710 --> 00:35:13,440
because you're not getting it and

1067
00:35:17,109 --> 00:35:14,720
they're not getting it

1068
00:35:18,310 --> 00:35:17,119
and so and i think that's really

1069
00:35:21,030 --> 00:35:18,320
training you that's why

1070
00:35:21,349 --> 00:35:21,040
astrobiologists have i think a good you

1071
00:35:24,310 --> 00:35:21,359
know

1072
00:35:25,750 --> 00:35:24,320
way off without noticing it you'll learn

1073
00:35:27,750 --> 00:35:25,760
to communicate

1074
00:35:29,109 --> 00:35:27,760
to just the community out there to

1075
00:35:30,470 --> 00:35:29,119
everybody

1076
00:35:32,310 --> 00:35:30,480
because you're trying to explain

1077
00:35:32,870 --> 00:35:32,320
something that you know you're learning

1078
00:35:35,030 --> 00:35:32,880
it by

1079
00:35:36,390 --> 00:35:35,040
through the apricot experience and i

1080
00:35:38,230 --> 00:35:36,400
think that's the most important thing

1081
00:35:39,510 --> 00:35:38,240
that you learn to simplify things like

1082
00:35:41,109 --> 00:35:39,520
feyman said once

1083
00:35:43,109 --> 00:35:41,119
you know if you can't explain it in a

1084
00:35:44,950 --> 00:35:43,119
few simple words you didn't get it

1085
00:35:46,710 --> 00:35:44,960
and i totally agree on that you know

1086
00:35:48,150 --> 00:35:46,720
once you throw all these beautiful

1087
00:35:49,829 --> 00:35:48,160
you know complicated words that you

1088
00:35:51,589 --> 00:35:49,839
reuse for publications

1089
00:35:52,870 --> 00:35:51,599
if you can't simplify this and explain

1090
00:35:55,589 --> 00:35:52,880
it to a kiddo

1091
00:35:56,069 --> 00:35:55,599
you haven't gotten your your stuff and

1092
00:35:59,109 --> 00:35:56,079
um

1093
00:36:02,950 --> 00:35:59,119
yeah so that's what i love about it and

1094
00:36:07,030 --> 00:36:05,109
yeah for me and one of the f great cons

1095
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:07,040
uh the later ones that i um

1096
00:36:11,349 --> 00:36:09,440
attended there was this science flash

1097
00:36:12,710 --> 00:36:11,359
competition like a fame lab like thing

1098
00:36:14,790 --> 00:36:12,720
in the beginning

1099
00:36:16,710 --> 00:36:14,800
and so i rather learned that it's

1100
00:36:18,870 --> 00:36:16,720
actually not that easy to do it

1101
00:36:20,790 --> 00:36:18,880
i think i got the lowest points of all

1102
00:36:21,750 --> 00:36:20,800
the 10 participants if i still remember

1103
00:36:23,510 --> 00:36:21,760
correctly

1104
00:36:25,270 --> 00:36:23,520
because before you think well i just

1105
00:36:26,950 --> 00:36:25,280
take a couple of slides say a little bit

1106
00:36:28,870 --> 00:36:26,960
things and then that's it

1107
00:36:30,950 --> 00:36:28,880
and then i saw these nine amazing

1108
00:36:32,230 --> 00:36:30,960
presentations from the american students

1109
00:36:35,270 --> 00:36:32,240
and they're like oh

1110
00:36:37,109 --> 00:36:35,280
okay i it's really so much more work

1111
00:36:39,589 --> 00:36:37,119
to actually do a good public outreach

1112
00:36:42,550 --> 00:36:39,599
talk than to do a science talk

1113
00:36:44,710 --> 00:36:42,560
so by really not doing a good job i

1114
00:36:46,950 --> 00:36:44,720
actually learned a lot

1115
00:36:48,630 --> 00:36:46,960
i i hope i didn't prove a little bit

1116
00:36:50,069 --> 00:36:48,640
it's not that bad as in the beginning

1117
00:36:51,510 --> 00:36:50,079
anymore but it's really it's really

1118
00:36:53,349 --> 00:36:51,520
tough but it's so important

1119
00:36:55,589 --> 00:36:53,359
and it's so much fun also if you see the

1120
00:36:57,510 --> 00:36:55,599
audience coming back to you

1121
00:36:59,109 --> 00:36:57,520
absolutely uh and i do have to mention

1122
00:36:59,829 --> 00:36:59,119
real quick for our audience uh those

1123
00:37:01,829 --> 00:36:59,839
watching

1124
00:37:03,430 --> 00:37:01,839
if you have questions for anyone

1125
00:37:05,109 --> 00:37:03,440
specific of our guests

1126
00:37:06,870 --> 00:37:05,119
feel free to reach out now in the chats

1127
00:37:08,310 --> 00:37:06,880
and let us know or if you just have a

1128
00:37:10,710 --> 00:37:08,320
general question you want to ask

1129
00:37:12,390 --> 00:37:10,720
any of our guests they can all answer uh

1130
00:37:13,750 --> 00:37:12,400
feel free to reach out now in the chats

1131
00:37:15,510 --> 00:37:13,760
and start asking questions and

1132
00:37:16,870 --> 00:37:15,520
i'll open up that audience chat here in

1133
00:37:20,630 --> 00:37:16,880
just a second

1134
00:37:22,950 --> 00:37:20,640
um but i absolutely agree i did fame lab

1135
00:37:24,310 --> 00:37:22,960
through abradcon and that changed the

1136
00:37:26,150 --> 00:37:24,320
course of my career

1137
00:37:27,349 --> 00:37:26,160
uh just by learning how to communicate

1138
00:37:28,870 --> 00:37:27,359
and i love that there was a

1139
00:37:30,470 --> 00:37:28,880
communication workshop

1140
00:37:32,150 --> 00:37:30,480
inside of fame lab that we were also

1141
00:37:35,109 --> 00:37:32,160
learning how to share

1142
00:37:36,790 --> 00:37:35,119
our science uh so let me see some

1143
00:37:37,510 --> 00:37:36,800
questions here from our audience we have

1144
00:38:29,430 --> 00:37:37,520
a

1145
00:38:32,950 --> 00:38:29,440
the u.s coming from

1146
00:38:35,750 --> 00:38:32,960
from europe um and i just

1147
00:38:36,870 --> 00:38:35,760
uh reached out to people who were

1148
00:38:38,870 --> 00:38:36,880
astrobiologists

1149
00:38:40,630 --> 00:38:38,880
uh so i found them i went through i

1150
00:38:41,430 --> 00:38:40,640
typed that astrobiology or something

1151
00:38:43,349 --> 00:38:41,440
like that

1152
00:38:45,190 --> 00:38:43,359
i got taken to a website that said well

1153
00:38:46,790 --> 00:38:45,200
they hear these these teams doing

1154
00:38:49,510 --> 00:38:46,800
astrology research

1155
00:38:50,150 --> 00:38:49,520
um and and here are the people you know

1156
00:38:52,870 --> 00:38:50,160
who lead

1157
00:38:53,430 --> 00:38:52,880
these teams and and who are part of them

1158
00:38:54,790 --> 00:38:53,440
um

1159
00:38:57,510 --> 00:38:54,800
i had you know i didn't have really a

1160
00:38:59,270 --> 00:38:57,520
clue about how to do research in

1161
00:39:00,630 --> 00:38:59,280
in science like look up scientific

1162
00:39:03,990 --> 00:39:00,640
papers and so on so i just

1163
00:39:06,230 --> 00:39:04,000
really went off of websites and i kind

1164
00:39:08,870 --> 00:39:06,240
of started emailing these people

1165
00:39:10,310 --> 00:39:08,880
um and some never answered maybe you

1166
00:39:12,470 --> 00:39:10,320
know the ten percent who did

1167
00:39:14,470 --> 00:39:12,480
kind of pointed me to the next level and

1168
00:39:15,829 --> 00:39:14,480
that's kind of how i got to

1169
00:39:17,190 --> 00:39:15,839
i got to reach out to them i learned

1170
00:39:18,870 --> 00:39:17,200
that there was such a thing as an

1171
00:39:22,150 --> 00:39:18,880
astrobiology science conference

1172
00:39:25,109 --> 00:39:22,160
um at that time i had gotten a small

1173
00:39:26,710 --> 00:39:25,119
um student grant to travel and so i used

1174
00:39:28,150 --> 00:39:26,720
it to go to that conference so it was at

1175
00:39:29,990 --> 00:39:28,160
icon in 2010

1176
00:39:31,990 --> 00:39:30,000
and there it was you know everyone was

1177
00:39:34,310 --> 00:39:32,000
there so i just like

1178
00:39:35,990 --> 00:39:34,320
i i was emailing people you know maybe

1179
00:39:38,310 --> 00:39:36,000
20 20 30 people

1180
00:39:40,390 --> 00:39:38,320
uh and asking to meet them at the breaks

1181
00:39:42,150 --> 00:39:40,400
because i was interested in doing school

1182
00:39:43,109 --> 00:39:42,160
and so on and it's just kind of hard got

1183
00:39:48,950 --> 00:39:43,119
to

1184
00:39:51,030 --> 00:39:48,960
from a short

1185
00:39:55,589 --> 00:39:51,040
informal conversation and that was my

1186
00:39:59,910 --> 00:39:58,069
yeah i i agree with this that you should

1187
00:40:00,630 --> 00:39:59,920
reach out i mean that's kind of how i

1188
00:40:02,390 --> 00:40:00,640
got into

1189
00:40:05,190 --> 00:40:02,400
i mean i just contacted someone who

1190
00:40:06,790 --> 00:40:05,200
called themselves an astrobiologist and

1191
00:40:08,309 --> 00:40:06,800
and i think but i mean the first thing

1192
00:40:11,190 --> 00:40:08,319
you can do is get a good

1193
00:40:13,430 --> 00:40:11,200
like degree in some of the you know

1194
00:40:16,309 --> 00:40:13,440
undergraduate degree master's degree in

1195
00:40:18,470 --> 00:40:16,319
in one of their subjects like biology

1196
00:40:21,030 --> 00:40:18,480
astronomy geology

1197
00:40:23,109 --> 00:40:21,040
which doesn't mean you have to do that

1198
00:40:25,190 --> 00:40:23,119
when you do astrobiology because i did

1199
00:40:26,150 --> 00:40:25,200
you know masters in engineering biology

1200
00:40:29,750 --> 00:40:26,160
and then

1201
00:40:31,030 --> 00:40:29,760
geochemistry when i did my phd so

1202
00:40:33,750 --> 00:40:31,040
there's always the

1203
00:40:35,670 --> 00:40:33,760
which i kind of love about astrobiology

1204
00:40:37,510 --> 00:40:35,680
that you can kind of transfer from one

1205
00:40:40,950 --> 00:40:37,520
subject to another

1206
00:40:42,550 --> 00:40:40,960
and but i mean get some type of a degree

1207
00:40:44,470 --> 00:40:42,560
and then you know contact people

1208
00:40:46,550 --> 00:40:44,480
i mean i have people that are doing high

1209
00:40:48,309 --> 00:40:46,560
school and they ask for projects and

1210
00:40:50,630 --> 00:40:48,319
like try to guide them to like you can

1211
00:40:52,870 --> 00:40:50,640
do this or that then

1212
00:40:54,790 --> 00:40:52,880
i think that's the best way to contact

1213
00:40:56,309 --> 00:40:54,800
people and

1214
00:40:58,309 --> 00:40:56,319
there's always going to be someone who's

1215
00:40:59,750 --> 00:40:58,319
going to help you so

1216
00:41:01,670 --> 00:40:59,760
it's a very good point actually let's

1217
00:41:03,829 --> 00:41:01,680
broaden this out then a little bit

1218
00:41:04,870 --> 00:41:03,839
um so someone who contacted me many

1219
00:41:07,270 --> 00:41:04,880
years ago

1220
00:41:08,870 --> 00:41:07,280
through social media who i first met

1221
00:41:10,230 --> 00:41:08,880
because i helped run the university

1222
00:41:12,950 --> 00:41:10,240
rover challenge

1223
00:41:14,870 --> 00:41:12,960
an undergraduate mars rover competition

1224
00:41:16,550 --> 00:41:14,880
and he was a member of a team from india

1225
00:41:18,309 --> 00:41:16,560
called rudra

1226
00:41:19,910 --> 00:41:18,319
and he reached out to me online and

1227
00:41:21,670 --> 00:41:19,920
started connecting and just asking me

1228
00:41:23,750 --> 00:41:21,680
very simple questions

1229
00:41:25,190 --> 00:41:23,760
and then this summer he ended up working

1230
00:41:26,870 --> 00:41:25,200
for me as an intern

1231
00:41:28,150 --> 00:41:26,880
and now he's a visiting scholar at our

1232
00:41:29,589 --> 00:41:28,160
non-profit working with me doing

1233
00:41:30,309 --> 00:41:29,599
research he's writing a book chapter

1234
00:41:33,670 --> 00:41:30,319
with me

1235
00:41:35,750 --> 00:41:33,680
uh his name is anna root mohanty uh at

1236
00:41:37,270 --> 00:41:35,760
on twitter and he has a question kind of

1237
00:41:38,870 --> 00:41:37,280
in a similar vein so we can open this

1238
00:41:40,069 --> 00:41:38,880
this this undergraduate conversation a

1239
00:41:42,150 --> 00:41:40,079
little bit more yet

1240
00:41:43,990 --> 00:41:42,160
uh honoraroop has asked what do you wish

1241
00:41:46,390 --> 00:41:44,000
you had done differently

1242
00:41:47,510 --> 00:41:46,400
as an undergraduate or what is something

1243
00:41:49,510 --> 00:41:47,520
that undergrads which

1244
00:41:51,109 --> 00:41:49,520
should be doing to become good

1245
00:41:52,870 --> 00:41:51,119
scientists right now

1246
00:41:56,230 --> 00:41:52,880
uh do any of you have any thoughts in

1247
00:42:00,870 --> 00:41:58,790
well i would say what you should be

1248
00:42:03,270 --> 00:42:00,880
doing not should not be doing really

1249
00:42:04,470 --> 00:42:03,280
do watch and sounds cheesy but it's you

1250
00:42:07,270 --> 00:42:04,480
really do what you like

1251
00:42:07,910 --> 00:42:07,280
uh very very frankly don't overthink it

1252
00:42:11,190 --> 00:42:07,920
what is

1253
00:42:14,069 --> 00:42:11,200
best for my curriculum so i will be

1254
00:42:15,030 --> 00:42:14,079
no that's ridiculous just because doing

1255
00:42:16,790 --> 00:42:15,040
something

1256
00:42:18,069 --> 00:42:16,800
is very different from finding the

1257
00:42:19,589 --> 00:42:18,079
question interesting

1258
00:42:21,349 --> 00:42:19,599
you know you might find galaxy

1259
00:42:22,790 --> 00:42:21,359
information really fascinating question

1260
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:22,800
which we all do but when you're stuck

1261
00:42:26,870 --> 00:42:24,880
with the computer and you know multi

1262
00:42:28,950 --> 00:42:26,880
uh like thousand body simulations which

1263
00:42:31,109 --> 00:42:28,960
are only dots and you only do numerical

1264
00:42:32,309 --> 00:42:31,119
uh you know fitting you might be really

1265
00:42:34,230 --> 00:42:32,319
bored so

1266
00:42:35,430 --> 00:42:34,240
go and explore many different things and

1267
00:42:37,270 --> 00:42:35,440
see what you really enjoy

1268
00:42:39,030 --> 00:42:37,280
doing do you enjoy lab work do you enjoy

1269
00:42:41,829 --> 00:42:39,040
computer work do you enjoy

1270
00:42:43,109 --> 00:42:41,839
doing tech doing you know more you gotta

1271
00:42:44,790 --> 00:42:43,119
figure that out because

1272
00:42:47,030 --> 00:42:44,800
once you're through you're gonna do this

1273
00:42:49,430 --> 00:42:47,040
every day and

1274
00:42:51,030 --> 00:42:49,440
so and of course you'll transition but

1275
00:42:53,430 --> 00:42:51,040
do what you

1276
00:42:55,750 --> 00:42:53,440
find out not just where you're good at

1277
00:42:56,950 --> 00:42:55,760
but what you really enjoy on a daily day

1278
00:42:58,470 --> 00:42:56,960
basis

1279
00:43:00,230 --> 00:42:58,480
and that's i think an important thing to

1280
00:43:03,670 --> 00:43:00,240
be done and then the rest will take care

1281
00:43:06,710 --> 00:43:05,430
yeah i would agree to that and i also

1282
00:43:08,309 --> 00:43:06,720
think that there are a lot of different

1283
00:43:09,750 --> 00:43:08,319
ways of how you can get into the field

1284
00:43:12,150 --> 00:43:09,760
of astrobiology

1285
00:43:13,990 --> 00:43:12,160
and if you start with something that you

1286
00:43:16,069 --> 00:43:14,000
feel comfortable in i think that's much

1287
00:43:16,710 --> 00:43:16,079
more important than having a strategic

1288
00:43:19,030 --> 00:43:16,720
plan

1289
00:43:20,470 --> 00:43:19,040
oh i need to start biogeochemistry i

1290
00:43:22,150 --> 00:43:20,480
actually i don't like biology i don't

1291
00:43:24,230 --> 00:43:22,160
like chemistry but this actually brings

1292
00:43:27,030 --> 00:43:24,240
me to astrobiology in the end

1293
00:43:29,270 --> 00:43:27,040
this is not going to work out but if you

1294
00:43:31,030 --> 00:43:29,280
if you like what you're doing and if you

1295
00:43:33,109 --> 00:43:31,040
as the other said before have the

1296
00:43:34,390 --> 00:43:33,119
connections or build up the connections

1297
00:43:35,910 --> 00:43:34,400
to astrobiologists

1298
00:43:36,090 --> 00:43:35,920
that's i think there's the best way to

1299
00:43:38,309 --> 00:43:36,100
go

1300
00:43:40,870 --> 00:43:38,319
[Music]

1301
00:43:42,550 --> 00:43:40,880
yeah it's very cool yeah i mean i also

1302
00:43:44,470 --> 00:43:42,560
as an undergraduate studied in different

1303
00:43:45,990 --> 00:43:44,480
areas in biology and chemistry and then

1304
00:43:48,390 --> 00:43:46,000
astrophysics and then

1305
00:43:50,550 --> 00:43:48,400
went to geology and it wasn't until my

1306
00:43:51,829 --> 00:43:50,560
phd in geology that i realized i loved

1307
00:43:53,670 --> 00:43:51,839
being out in the field

1308
00:43:55,510 --> 00:43:53,680
and i loved carrying rocks in my

1309
00:43:57,589 --> 00:43:55,520
backpack and i loved being

1310
00:43:59,190 --> 00:43:57,599
outdoors with my science that i wasn't

1311
00:44:00,230 --> 00:43:59,200
really as into the laboratory as i

1312
00:44:01,670 --> 00:44:00,240
thought i was

1313
00:44:03,109 --> 00:44:01,680
uh and so yeah it's very important to

1314
00:44:04,470 --> 00:44:03,119
explore these different things and find

1315
00:44:08,309 --> 00:44:04,480
what really does

1316
00:44:09,589 --> 00:44:08,319
another question

1317
00:44:11,510 --> 00:44:09,599
um that has come into us from an

1318
00:44:14,470 --> 00:44:11,520
anonymous source uh

1319
00:44:15,349 --> 00:44:14,480
is where do you think if there is life

1320
00:44:17,430 --> 00:44:15,359
out there

1321
00:44:18,870 --> 00:44:17,440
where do you think we might most likely

1322
00:44:21,190 --> 00:44:18,880
find alien life

1323
00:44:21,990 --> 00:44:21,200
first and i imagine maybe you each have

1324
00:44:24,069 --> 00:44:22,000
a different opinion

1325
00:44:25,430 --> 00:44:24,079
on this so i'd love to hear it i don't

1326
00:44:28,630 --> 00:44:25,440
know maybe i'm biased

1327
00:44:30,550 --> 00:44:28,640
morse but no but i mean

1328
00:44:31,670 --> 00:44:30,560
i guess with all the resources we're

1329
00:44:34,309 --> 00:44:31,680
putting into mars

1330
00:44:36,230 --> 00:44:34,319
i mean there's a big chance you know i

1331
00:44:38,790 --> 00:44:36,240
mean considering the number of uh

1332
00:44:39,270 --> 00:44:38,800
just missions and now but i mean i don't

1333
00:44:41,349 --> 00:44:39,280
know if

1334
00:44:43,430 --> 00:44:41,359
mars is it depends also are you looking

1335
00:44:46,390 --> 00:44:43,440
for extinct life or extinct life i'm

1336
00:44:47,910 --> 00:44:46,400
assuming we're talking about extent life

1337
00:44:50,150 --> 00:44:47,920
maybe mars is not the

1338
00:44:52,309 --> 00:44:50,160
the right place it might be better with

1339
00:44:53,190 --> 00:44:52,319
the ocean worlds you know around the

1340
00:44:55,349 --> 00:44:53,200
moons

1341
00:44:56,870 --> 00:44:55,359
i don't know i try to when people ask me

1342
00:44:57,750 --> 00:44:56,880
this question i should try to keep an

1343
00:44:59,990 --> 00:44:57,760
open mind

1344
00:45:02,309 --> 00:45:00,000
to keep you know not being said that i'm

1345
00:45:04,069 --> 00:45:02,319
gonna find you know life on mars but

1346
00:45:05,990 --> 00:45:04,079
you know look at the evidence you know

1347
00:45:07,670 --> 00:45:06,000
so fairly agnostic

1348
00:45:09,190 --> 00:45:07,680
yeah how about you mark what do you

1349
00:45:11,430 --> 00:45:09,200
think where might we find alien life

1350
00:45:13,910 --> 00:45:11,440
first if it's out there

1351
00:45:15,190 --> 00:45:13,920
yeah thanks for the segue sandra uh i

1352
00:45:17,430 --> 00:45:15,200
think getting question worlds might be

1353
00:45:20,790 --> 00:45:17,440
the way to go it's my personal bias

1354
00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:20,800
um you know it's always 20 years away uh

1355
00:45:23,910 --> 00:45:23,280
live detection and so um so i'm trying

1356
00:45:25,510 --> 00:45:23,920
to look at

1357
00:45:27,750 --> 00:45:25,520
the most promising places so that

1358
00:45:30,710 --> 00:45:27,760
there's mars i see worlds

1359
00:45:31,430 --> 00:45:30,720
planets in other solar systems and i

1360
00:45:34,870 --> 00:45:31,440
just

1361
00:45:36,390 --> 00:45:34,880
feel like um you know

1362
00:45:38,150 --> 00:45:36,400
these these ocean worlds some of them

1363
00:45:40,550 --> 00:45:38,160
spew some of their oceans

1364
00:45:42,069 --> 00:45:40,560
out into space we call it cryovolcanisms

1365
00:45:42,870 --> 00:45:42,079
like cold volcanism but the magma's

1366
00:45:46,309 --> 00:45:42,880
water

1367
00:45:48,470 --> 00:45:46,319
and so if you you know it it makes uh

1368
00:45:49,990 --> 00:45:48,480
pieces of the ocean no droplets that

1369
00:45:51,510 --> 00:45:50,000
that freeze once they go up

1370
00:45:53,829 --> 00:45:51,520
accessible by spacecraft that you don't

1371
00:45:57,190 --> 00:45:53,839
even have to drill down

1372
00:45:57,670 --> 00:45:57,200
um it's a fresh sample uh there's good

1373
00:45:59,510 --> 00:45:57,680
chance

1374
00:46:01,670 --> 00:45:59,520
the oceans have the the ingredients for

1375
00:46:02,390 --> 00:46:01,680
life uh in some cases we only we know it

1376
00:46:05,589 --> 00:46:02,400
already

1377
00:46:07,430 --> 00:46:05,599
um and it's just not not all that hard

1378
00:46:09,589 --> 00:46:07,440
to do in the grand scheme of things

1379
00:46:11,349 --> 00:46:09,599
uh so that's you know if there is life

1380
00:46:14,870 --> 00:46:11,359
there i think we'll we'll know

1381
00:46:15,750 --> 00:46:14,880
in the next 20 years that's me again in

1382
00:46:18,950 --> 00:46:15,760
20 years

1383
00:46:20,870 --> 00:46:18,960
lina

1384
00:46:21,990 --> 00:46:20,880
what do you think is it 20 years away

1385
00:46:24,470 --> 00:46:22,000
and if not

1386
00:46:26,790 --> 00:46:24,480
or if so where might we find alien life

1387
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:26,800
do you think

1388
00:46:29,990 --> 00:46:28,400
well i guess the question is do you

1389
00:46:33,109 --> 00:46:30,000
really mean find

1390
00:46:36,390 --> 00:46:33,119
a clear proof of life or

1391
00:46:37,430 --> 00:46:36,400
think we may have found life because i

1392
00:46:40,309 --> 00:46:37,440
think for for

1393
00:46:42,069 --> 00:46:40,319
thinking that we may have found life we

1394
00:46:43,990 --> 00:46:42,079
may not even have to wait that

1395
00:46:45,430 --> 00:46:44,000
long but then we should look outside of

1396
00:46:47,589 --> 00:46:45,440
the solar system

1397
00:46:49,750 --> 00:46:47,599
i think with something like james webb

1398
00:46:51,349 --> 00:46:49,760
space telescope coming up uh our chances

1399
00:46:53,910 --> 00:46:51,359
are really strong to good

1400
00:46:55,589 --> 00:46:53,920
very surprising signatures in

1401
00:46:58,790 --> 00:46:55,599
atmospheres of exoplanets that

1402
00:47:00,309 --> 00:46:58,800
we may not be able to explain unless

1403
00:47:02,309 --> 00:47:00,319
there might be life on it

1404
00:47:04,790 --> 00:47:02,319
but i always say as long as it doesn't

1405
00:47:07,910 --> 00:47:04,800
talk to you you don't know it's alive

1406
00:47:09,510 --> 00:47:07,920
so the first proof i think

1407
00:47:11,670 --> 00:47:09,520
like a real proof unless we have

1408
00:47:12,870 --> 00:47:11,680
communication can only be in the solar

1409
00:47:15,030 --> 00:47:12,880
system

1410
00:47:16,309 --> 00:47:15,040
that's a good point yeah very hard you

1411
00:47:18,150 --> 00:47:16,319
know we saw with what

1412
00:47:20,150 --> 00:47:18,160
is currently a debate about whether or

1413
00:47:22,069 --> 00:47:20,160
not there is phosphine on venus

1414
00:47:23,190 --> 00:47:22,079
uh it's also making us question you know

1415
00:47:25,109 --> 00:47:23,200
we consider some

1416
00:47:26,390 --> 00:47:25,119
potential gases to be potential

1417
00:47:27,670 --> 00:47:26,400
biosignatures

1418
00:47:29,109 --> 00:47:27,680
but maybe we'll find them on an

1419
00:47:30,870 --> 00:47:29,119
exoplanet and we won't have any way to

1420
00:47:31,750 --> 00:47:30,880
test whether or not there is a biosphere

1421
00:47:33,190 --> 00:47:31,760
there

1422
00:47:34,950 --> 00:47:33,200
but it is very exciting for james webb

1423
00:47:36,150 --> 00:47:34,960
space telescope and and some of these

1424
00:47:37,750 --> 00:47:36,160
other next generation telescope

1425
00:47:39,829 --> 00:47:37,760
proposals like lavoir

1426
00:47:41,190 --> 00:47:39,839
origin space telescope links there's so

1427
00:47:42,390 --> 00:47:41,200
many cool proposals for upcoming

1428
00:47:45,270 --> 00:47:42,400
telescopes that

1429
00:47:46,390 --> 00:47:45,280
are very exciting uh vlada how about you

1430
00:47:50,230 --> 00:47:46,400
where do you think we might find

1431
00:47:53,190 --> 00:47:50,240
alien life if it's out there i think

1432
00:47:54,870 --> 00:47:53,200
the circle was really nicely closed now

1433
00:47:57,349 --> 00:47:54,880
the problem is i think right now

1434
00:47:59,030 --> 00:47:57,359
we're still in the phase of uh believing

1435
00:48:00,710 --> 00:47:59,040
uh and believe it doesn't fit into

1436
00:48:01,349 --> 00:48:00,720
science in any way we need to think

1437
00:48:03,670 --> 00:48:01,359
right

1438
00:48:05,349 --> 00:48:03,680
think mean statistics needs numbers

1439
00:48:06,710 --> 00:48:05,359
let's look at the methane example on

1440
00:48:09,270 --> 00:48:06,720
mars you know

1441
00:48:11,270 --> 00:48:09,280
when i started my phd in 2008 that's the

1442
00:48:12,950 --> 00:48:11,280
first time i got you know

1443
00:48:15,510 --> 00:48:12,960
we started talking about that i was

1444
00:48:16,470 --> 00:48:15,520
aware of it it's now 12 12 years down

1445
00:48:18,470 --> 00:48:16,480
the line

1446
00:48:20,150 --> 00:48:18,480
and we have you know this spikes of

1447
00:48:22,230 --> 00:48:20,160
methane on mars which might be coming

1448
00:48:25,670 --> 00:48:22,240
from the subsurface might be indicating

1449
00:48:27,990 --> 00:48:25,680
aqueous activity or maybe life and

1450
00:48:29,750 --> 00:48:28,000
and look we we have you know great

1451
00:48:32,870 --> 00:48:29,760
instruments there we have no clue yet

1452
00:48:33,430 --> 00:48:32,880
it's it's purely you know it's it's of

1453
00:48:36,470 --> 00:48:33,440
course

1454
00:48:37,190 --> 00:48:36,480
it's more uh it's not really science at

1455
00:48:40,470 --> 00:48:37,200
the level we

1456
00:48:42,069 --> 00:48:40,480
don't have enough data and i'm afraid

1457
00:48:45,030 --> 00:48:42,079
that's the whole thing even you know

1458
00:48:45,589 --> 00:48:45,040
i did extra planets and then i i felt

1459
00:48:48,069 --> 00:48:45,599
like

1460
00:48:49,030 --> 00:48:48,079
well because of realizing what's going

1461
00:48:51,510 --> 00:48:49,040
on on mars

1462
00:48:52,870 --> 00:48:51,520
even when we see interesting features on

1463
00:48:54,710 --> 00:48:52,880
exoplanets

1464
00:48:56,630 --> 00:48:54,720
will not have the tech and the ability

1465
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:56,640
to really make something out of it and

1466
00:48:59,510 --> 00:48:57,839
it's you know the media is going to rip

1467
00:49:00,950 --> 00:48:59,520
it in pieces and one point they will

1468
00:49:03,430 --> 00:49:00,960
also be tired and then

1469
00:49:04,549 --> 00:49:03,440
at one point the community will be tired

1470
00:49:07,349 --> 00:49:04,559
and um

1471
00:49:08,390 --> 00:49:07,359
you know i've uh i remember i had in

1472
00:49:11,829 --> 00:49:08,400
2000 and

1473
00:49:13,589 --> 00:49:11,839
damn now two years ago a paper uh on

1474
00:49:15,510 --> 00:49:13,599
and on oxygen brian's and the potential

1475
00:49:17,190 --> 00:49:15,520
of life in mars and made really like

1476
00:49:19,349 --> 00:49:17,200
a lot of you know news all over the

1477
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:19,359
world but i remember only one person

1478
00:49:21,829 --> 00:49:20,880
which i really liked a comment and it

1479
00:49:25,030 --> 00:49:21,839
was somebody

1480
00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:25,040
a a newspaper in india that wrote down

1481
00:49:30,870 --> 00:49:28,400
i'm done with nasa uh i'm so bored by

1482
00:49:32,790 --> 00:49:30,880
what people are telling us that if maybe

1483
00:49:35,349 --> 00:49:32,800
is maybe some kind of life

1484
00:49:37,270 --> 00:49:35,359
i will not listen to anything they tell

1485
00:49:39,750 --> 00:49:37,280
us until they really have not found it

1486
00:49:41,109 --> 00:49:39,760
i'm done and i love that and i kept that

1487
00:49:43,430 --> 00:49:41,119
article because

1488
00:49:44,710 --> 00:49:43,440
it really actually conveyed the message

1489
00:49:47,990 --> 00:49:44,720
um we

1490
00:49:49,910 --> 00:49:48,000
as scientists need to look not

1491
00:49:52,150 --> 00:49:49,920
you know as much as 20 years in the

1492
00:49:54,630 --> 00:49:52,160
future always 30 years in the future

1493
00:49:55,589 --> 00:49:54,640
we have to have more data so i

1494
00:49:57,829 --> 00:49:55,599
personally think

1495
00:49:59,109 --> 00:49:57,839
the subsurface of mars is a very good

1496
00:50:01,510 --> 00:49:59,119
place for life

1497
00:50:02,870 --> 00:50:01,520
signs of life to exist still today so

1498
00:50:04,950 --> 00:50:02,880
life to exist today

1499
00:50:06,309 --> 00:50:04,960
i think that the subsurface of mars has

1500
00:50:08,790 --> 00:50:06,319
been also the best place

1501
00:50:10,549 --> 00:50:08,800
in the past so even if we find no

1502
00:50:11,109 --> 00:50:10,559
science on the surface what we focus

1503
00:50:13,670 --> 00:50:11,119
right now

1504
00:50:15,589 --> 00:50:13,680
doesn't mean anything uh we might be

1505
00:50:20,230 --> 00:50:15,599
just looking at the wrong spots

1506
00:50:23,190 --> 00:50:20,240
um and ocean worlds wow amazing as well

1507
00:50:25,109 --> 00:50:23,200
the realm of exoplanets but again if you

1508
00:50:26,630 --> 00:50:25,119
want to do science the only thing to do

1509
00:50:28,470 --> 00:50:26,640
that the only way to do that is

1510
00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:28,480
that we don't wait always 20 years in

1511
00:50:32,950 --> 00:50:30,960
the future that we don't get

1512
00:50:35,030 --> 00:50:32,960
always you know our dream mission and

1513
00:50:37,030 --> 00:50:35,040
then we cut it by 90

1514
00:50:38,710 --> 00:50:37,040
because that's what the budget allows

1515
00:50:40,470 --> 00:50:38,720
and we as scientists know the

1516
00:50:41,910 --> 00:50:40,480
instruments we're sending will not

1517
00:50:43,750 --> 00:50:41,920
really allow us to have

1518
00:50:45,349 --> 00:50:43,760
anything more than oh maybe there is

1519
00:50:49,270 --> 00:50:45,359
something interesting

1520
00:50:52,150 --> 00:50:49,280
um so you know unless we don't wanna

1521
00:50:52,470 --> 00:50:52,160
wait for always 20 years in the future

1522
00:50:54,870 --> 00:50:52,480
uh

1523
00:50:56,710 --> 00:50:54,880
we really gotta spice up our game with

1524
00:50:59,589 --> 00:50:56,720
international collaborations

1525
00:51:00,549 --> 00:50:59,599
uh with you know private companies uh

1526
00:51:03,829 --> 00:51:00,559
with getting

1527
00:51:05,589 --> 00:51:03,839
things out there much faster otherwise

1528
00:51:07,109 --> 00:51:05,599
you know in 40 years from now we'll have

1529
00:51:08,470 --> 00:51:07,119
an upgrade con session again and

1530
00:51:10,470 --> 00:51:08,480
you ask the same question and it's going

1531
00:51:11,349 --> 00:51:10,480
to be the same answer what do you

1532
00:51:13,750 --> 00:51:11,359
believe

1533
00:51:15,750 --> 00:51:13,760
and not what are you certain about and i

1534
00:51:17,349 --> 00:51:15,760
want to be certain about those things

1535
00:51:19,030 --> 00:51:17,359
yeah it's very powerful it kind of

1536
00:51:21,670 --> 00:51:19,040
reminds me a little bit of

1537
00:51:22,870 --> 00:51:21,680
exploration of mars as well uh you know

1538
00:51:24,390 --> 00:51:22,880
it's always 20 years out that we're

1539
00:51:26,549 --> 00:51:24,400
gonna send humans to mars

1540
00:51:28,630 --> 00:51:26,559
and i remember as a kid i went to space

1541
00:51:30,069 --> 00:51:28,640
camp in the 1990s

1542
00:51:31,589 --> 00:51:30,079
and i remember being told that like my

1543
00:51:32,790 --> 00:51:31,599
generation would be the first ones when

1544
00:51:33,910 --> 00:51:32,800
i was 30 years old

1545
00:51:35,670 --> 00:51:33,920
i would be one of the first ones to go

1546
00:51:37,190 --> 00:51:35,680
to mars and then i remember as an

1547
00:51:38,549 --> 00:51:37,200
undergraduate i was communicating

1548
00:51:39,670 --> 00:51:38,559
science and i would tell children the

1549
00:51:42,549 --> 00:51:39,680
same thing in 20 years

1550
00:51:44,150 --> 00:51:42,559
we going to mars and and now to this day

1551
00:51:45,030 --> 00:51:44,160
i still hear some people saying that in

1552
00:51:47,349 --> 00:51:45,040
20 years

1553
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:47,359
we'll be going to mars uh and it's kind

1554
00:51:51,030 --> 00:51:48,960
of sad it's always

1555
00:51:54,150 --> 00:51:51,040
it's always 20 years until more summer

1556
00:51:57,510 --> 00:51:56,470
but i actually now it's only 10 years

1557
00:52:01,270 --> 00:51:57,520
actually

1558
00:52:04,069 --> 00:52:01,280
yeah so there is some progress so

1559
00:52:06,150 --> 00:52:04,079
celebration started ordering the 80s so

1560
00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:06,160
actually there was in the early 80s was

1561
00:52:09,030 --> 00:52:08,000
the formation of the first new mars

1562
00:52:10,710 --> 00:52:09,040
underground

1563
00:52:12,470 --> 00:52:10,720
which was against the space shuttle

1564
00:52:14,470 --> 00:52:12,480
program to finally start getting more

1565
00:52:17,589 --> 00:52:14,480
suns that's 40 years ago

1566
00:52:19,430 --> 00:52:17,599
40 years ago so things happen but i just

1567
00:52:20,150 --> 00:52:19,440
like to say one thing that's what comes

1568
00:52:23,030 --> 00:52:20,160
in you know

1569
00:52:23,910 --> 00:52:23,040
i was just doing only basic science and

1570
00:52:46,309 --> 00:52:23,920
i

1571
00:52:48,150 --> 00:52:46,319
another

1572
00:52:50,069 --> 00:52:48,160
uh solar system or extra planetary

1573
00:52:51,910 --> 00:52:50,079
object is beautiful it might be right

1574
00:52:53,990 --> 00:52:51,920
but we don't have the data to validate

1575
00:52:54,630 --> 00:52:54,000
it and until it's there it's philosophy

1576
00:52:56,950 --> 00:52:54,640
it's it's

1577
00:52:57,990 --> 00:52:56,960
a possibility but there's nothing to

1578
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:58,000
back it up in that

1579
00:53:01,750 --> 00:53:00,800
strong context and i joined jpl nasa

1580
00:53:04,549 --> 00:53:01,760
because i realized

1581
00:53:05,990 --> 00:53:04,559
we need to have data and missions to

1582
00:53:08,870 --> 00:53:06,000
really get that

1583
00:53:10,470 --> 00:53:08,880
and i've now joined blue origin because

1584
00:53:11,589 --> 00:53:10,480
ultimately and that's something for the

1585
00:53:14,390 --> 00:53:11,599
community out there

1586
00:53:15,430 --> 00:53:14,400
that's what you know nothing technology

1587
00:53:17,990 --> 00:53:15,440
is not really

1588
00:53:19,510 --> 00:53:18,000
our human brains are not limiting us we

1589
00:53:22,630 --> 00:53:19,520
can create technology

1590
00:53:24,069 --> 00:53:22,640
today that will allow us to go to all

1591
00:53:27,190 --> 00:53:24,079
those solar system objects

1592
00:53:29,349 --> 00:53:27,200
and do all the experiments we want to do

1593
00:53:31,430 --> 00:53:29,359
we have also technology that will allow

1594
00:53:33,750 --> 00:53:31,440
us to you know send humans to the moon

1595
00:53:36,549 --> 00:53:33,760
and live there and explore there

1596
00:53:37,589 --> 00:53:36,559
it's not that it's the policies the

1597
00:53:40,630 --> 00:53:37,599
politics

1598
00:53:42,069 --> 00:53:40,640
the money and until we haven't changed

1599
00:53:44,630 --> 00:53:42,079
that dogma

1600
00:53:45,990 --> 00:53:44,640
that you know that we as a human

1601
00:53:48,470 --> 00:53:46,000
federation can go

1602
00:53:49,430 --> 00:53:48,480
and really do together faster and and

1603
00:53:51,510 --> 00:53:49,440
more frequent

1604
00:53:52,790 --> 00:53:51,520
we'll be always stuck in that we're

1605
00:53:56,630 --> 00:53:52,800
chained by

1606
00:53:59,030 --> 00:53:56,640
a human concept not by our minds

1607
00:54:01,270 --> 00:53:59,040
yeah it seems like you know we we as

1608
00:54:03,030 --> 00:54:01,280
scientists especially in astrobiology

1609
00:54:04,790 --> 00:54:03,040
have had to persevere through this lack

1610
00:54:06,470 --> 00:54:04,800
of support in some places

1611
00:54:07,510 --> 00:54:06,480
uh and things like you know building our

1612
00:54:08,790 --> 00:54:07,520
networks and getting out there and

1613
00:54:09,750 --> 00:54:08,800
speaking to people and communicating

1614
00:54:11,430 --> 00:54:09,760
this with people

1615
00:54:13,349 --> 00:54:11,440
it helps us to build some support we

1616
00:54:15,430 --> 00:54:13,359
definitely need more of that

1617
00:54:16,470 --> 00:54:15,440
uh and that that kind of then you know

1618
00:54:18,230 --> 00:54:16,480
for those of us who

1619
00:54:19,750 --> 00:54:18,240
have been early career scientists in the

1620
00:54:21,030 --> 00:54:19,760
near past uh

1621
00:54:22,630 --> 00:54:21,040
kind of understand what it's like for

1622
00:54:23,990 --> 00:54:22,640
these early career scientists who want

1623
00:54:26,390 --> 00:54:24,000
to be involved in answering those

1624
00:54:27,750 --> 00:54:26,400
questions but don't have the data so we

1625
00:54:29,750 --> 00:54:27,760
have another question from sarah that

1626
00:54:32,150 --> 00:54:29,760
i'd like to ask of all of you

1627
00:54:34,069 --> 00:54:32,160
she wants to know what would you want

1628
00:54:36,549 --> 00:54:34,079
early career scientists to know

1629
00:54:38,069 --> 00:54:36,559
about failure and finding out how to

1630
00:54:40,390 --> 00:54:38,079
persevere through failure

1631
00:54:41,910 --> 00:54:40,400
and to stay motivated and i imagine

1632
00:54:42,630 --> 00:54:41,920
she's speaking primarily to career

1633
00:54:44,470 --> 00:54:42,640
failure but

1634
00:54:46,230 --> 00:54:44,480
there's all kinds of other other issues

1635
00:54:47,990 --> 00:54:46,240
with failure and these these these

1636
00:54:49,270 --> 00:54:48,000
roadblocks these gatekeepers and things

1637
00:54:51,829 --> 00:54:49,280
that are holding us back

1638
00:54:52,630 --> 00:54:51,839
from doing what we want to do uh so mark

1639
00:54:54,470 --> 00:54:52,640
how about you what

1640
00:54:56,470 --> 00:54:54,480
what do you think um about the

1641
00:54:58,549 --> 00:54:56,480
importance of finding perseverance uh

1642
00:55:01,510 --> 00:54:58,559
and staying motivated through failure

1643
00:55:02,549 --> 00:55:01,520
yeah so i'm very much convinced that as

1644
00:55:05,589 --> 00:55:02,559
scientists we're

1645
00:55:08,710 --> 00:55:05,599
we're kind of like uh athletes or uh

1646
00:55:10,390 --> 00:55:08,720
or artists it's like all the all the

1647
00:55:11,430 --> 00:55:10,400
glories on you but all the failures on

1648
00:55:13,190 --> 00:55:11,440
you as well

1649
00:55:14,950 --> 00:55:13,200
and um and you're very independent in

1650
00:55:17,109 --> 00:55:14,960
what you do and you kind of have to rely

1651
00:55:18,549 --> 00:55:17,119
on you on yourself mostly and you can

1652
00:55:20,390 --> 00:55:18,559
team up with people but

1653
00:55:22,309 --> 00:55:20,400
eventually it's not like you're you're

1654
00:55:23,750 --> 00:55:22,319
part of a corporation or something

1655
00:55:26,789 --> 00:55:23,760
so it has it has rewards and it has

1656
00:55:30,470 --> 00:55:26,799
risks um

1657
00:55:31,990 --> 00:55:30,480
it you know uh 99

1658
00:55:33,670 --> 00:55:32,000
of the of the singers are there out

1659
00:55:34,309 --> 00:55:33,680
there trying to do you know cover songs

1660
00:55:36,230 --> 00:55:34,319
and get out

1661
00:55:38,069 --> 00:55:36,240
on youtube and so on and and they don't

1662
00:55:40,630 --> 00:55:38,079
really and like this only

1663
00:55:43,270 --> 00:55:40,640
one percent is a is a superstar that

1664
00:55:45,109 --> 00:55:43,280
breaks out and and only a very small

1665
00:55:47,589 --> 00:55:45,119
amount of athletes you know go to the

1666
00:55:49,990 --> 00:55:47,599
olympics and get medals and so on

1667
00:55:50,710 --> 00:55:50,000
and uh and and what about all the others

1668
00:55:53,990 --> 00:55:50,720
right

1669
00:55:56,150 --> 00:55:54,000
um so i feel very fortunate to just be

1670
00:55:58,150 --> 00:55:56,160
part like be able to do this i mean

1671
00:56:01,190 --> 00:55:58,160
people are paying you

1672
00:56:02,870 --> 00:56:01,200
to do something super interesting and uh

1673
00:56:04,390 --> 00:56:02,880
you know and and

1674
00:56:05,990 --> 00:56:04,400
most of the time your son won't make it

1675
00:56:06,870 --> 00:56:06,000
to the top 40 and most of your time you

1676
00:56:10,390 --> 00:56:06,880
will you will finish

1677
00:56:11,670 --> 00:56:10,400
295 fifth person in the race uh and same

1678
00:56:13,430 --> 00:56:11,680
thing in science your papers will get

1679
00:56:15,349 --> 00:56:13,440
rejected your proposals won't go through

1680
00:56:16,789 --> 00:56:15,359
you get i got declined for like 40 jobs

1681
00:56:19,670 --> 00:56:16,799
before i got this one

1682
00:56:21,030 --> 00:56:19,680
um the the key is just to to not really

1683
00:56:24,150 --> 00:56:21,040
focus on this but just

1684
00:56:26,549 --> 00:56:24,160
focus on on on where you are

1685
00:56:28,710 --> 00:56:26,559
and what's enabling you to to do this

1686
00:56:30,069 --> 00:56:28,720
and what let us said earlier about

1687
00:56:32,150 --> 00:56:30,079
really loving what you do and the

1688
00:56:35,910 --> 00:56:32,160
methods you use on a daily basis to do

1689
00:56:37,270 --> 00:56:35,920
it is key to to get through that

1690
00:56:39,349 --> 00:56:37,280
sandra how about you what what do you

1691
00:56:40,710 --> 00:56:39,359
think what you would say to to early

1692
00:56:43,109 --> 00:56:40,720
career scientists not just graduate

1693
00:56:44,549 --> 00:56:43,119
students but undergraduates postdocs

1694
00:56:46,309 --> 00:56:44,559
how do they persevere in the face of

1695
00:56:48,390 --> 00:56:46,319
failure well

1696
00:56:50,150 --> 00:56:48,400
considering i today got a proposal

1697
00:56:52,870 --> 00:56:50,160
rejected so

1698
00:56:53,750 --> 00:56:52,880
i'm kind of dealing with it today so

1699
00:56:55,589 --> 00:56:53,760
well you know

1700
00:56:57,270 --> 00:56:55,599
it's kind of like you have to prepare

1701
00:56:58,150 --> 00:56:57,280
you have to realize it's really hard to

1702
00:57:00,950 --> 00:56:58,160
get it and

1703
00:57:03,190 --> 00:57:00,960
uh and even when you're like your

1704
00:57:04,710 --> 00:57:03,200
proposal is you know rejected or your

1705
00:57:07,349 --> 00:57:04,720
manuscript is

1706
00:57:09,190 --> 00:57:07,359
you know rejected you always learn

1707
00:57:11,270 --> 00:57:09,200
something right you always

1708
00:57:13,510 --> 00:57:11,280
you should take the criticism and you

1709
00:57:15,349 --> 00:57:13,520
know sometimes it's valid and sometimes

1710
00:57:17,910 --> 00:57:15,359
it's not valid and you can always i mean

1711
00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:17,920
i had proposer rejected and then i just

1712
00:57:20,950 --> 00:57:20,160
you know rewrite them a bit and next

1713
00:57:23,829 --> 00:57:20,960
year they're

1714
00:57:25,750 --> 00:57:23,839
funded so i mean you have to kind of

1715
00:57:27,109 --> 00:57:25,760
expect this this is kind of part of the

1716
00:57:29,349 --> 00:57:27,119
game

1717
00:57:31,270 --> 00:57:29,359
but at the same time i i kind of also

1718
00:57:31,670 --> 00:57:31,280
feel honored that i get to work with

1719
00:57:33,510 --> 00:57:31,680
this

1720
00:57:35,670 --> 00:57:33,520
you know that actually someone is paying

1721
00:57:39,030 --> 00:57:35,680
me to do this you know so

1722
00:57:40,230 --> 00:57:39,040
and i get to you know take part a very

1723
00:57:42,390 --> 00:57:40,240
important decisions

1724
00:57:44,069 --> 00:57:42,400
you know like which samples do you bring

1725
00:57:47,030 --> 00:57:44,079
back from mars you know like this

1726
00:57:48,390 --> 00:57:47,040
and i feel honored about this so i think

1727
00:57:51,510 --> 00:57:48,400
you have to

1728
00:57:55,510 --> 00:57:51,520
good things and

1729
00:57:57,510 --> 00:57:55,520
and not get stuck in the bad things

1730
00:57:59,109 --> 00:57:57,520
even though i mean but you learn from

1731
00:58:02,789 --> 00:57:59,119
those i don't know like

1732
00:58:03,990 --> 00:58:02,799
this is what i do so yeah and then

1733
00:58:05,910 --> 00:58:04,000
it's good yeah you know you have to

1734
00:58:06,630 --> 00:58:05,920
learn how to persevere through those bad

1735
00:58:07,990 --> 00:58:06,640
things and

1736
00:58:09,510 --> 00:58:08,000
i think we get better and better at it

1737
00:58:11,349 --> 00:58:09,520
as we go along you know i remember my

1738
00:58:12,789 --> 00:58:11,359
very first paper i submitted that

1739
00:58:14,230 --> 00:58:12,799
you know people are just destroyed and i

1740
00:58:15,510 --> 00:58:14,240
was like oh i'm going to be a failure

1741
00:58:17,670 --> 00:58:15,520
the rest of my life and

1742
00:58:19,190 --> 00:58:17,680
you learn you know better vlada how

1743
00:58:20,150 --> 00:58:19,200
about you what do you think about this

1744
00:58:21,829 --> 00:58:20,160
issue with

1745
00:58:24,309 --> 00:58:21,839
with early career scientists having to

1746
00:58:26,069 --> 00:58:24,319
learn perseverance through failure

1747
00:58:27,670 --> 00:58:26,079
i would say we should all encourage each

1748
00:58:29,589 --> 00:58:27,680
other to fail

1749
00:58:31,510 --> 00:58:29,599
uh you know that's one thing which is

1750
00:58:33,510 --> 00:58:31,520
problematic in our society today we

1751
00:58:35,589 --> 00:58:33,520
we don't give ourselves the freedom to

1752
00:58:38,789 --> 00:58:35,599
fail many times you know

1753
00:58:41,270 --> 00:58:38,799
um i think in science you do

1754
00:58:43,109 --> 00:58:41,280
some scientific work and later data or

1755
00:58:46,549 --> 00:58:43,119
later work will show that it's wrong

1756
00:58:47,349 --> 00:58:46,559
and that's okay it's good you you learn

1757
00:58:49,589 --> 00:58:47,359
something

1758
00:58:51,910 --> 00:58:49,599
and only if we you know allow each other

1759
00:58:52,950 --> 00:58:51,920
to fail make mistakes only then can we

1760
00:58:55,750 --> 00:58:52,960
really

1761
00:58:57,190 --> 00:58:55,760
feel better and enjoy our work more and

1762
00:58:59,270 --> 00:58:57,200
do better work

1763
00:59:00,230 --> 00:58:59,280
um we you know it's really part of the

1764
00:59:03,270 --> 00:59:00,240
process you know

1765
00:59:04,069 --> 00:59:03,280
i do not you know think of a life of

1766
00:59:06,549 --> 00:59:04,079
brian

1767
00:59:07,990 --> 00:59:06,559
it was even after my time but showing

1768
00:59:09,510 --> 00:59:08,000
that we are older it's a movie

1769
00:59:11,910 --> 00:59:09,520
you know always look on the bright side

1770
00:59:13,510 --> 00:59:11,920
of life failure is a challenge it's

1771
00:59:15,030 --> 00:59:13,520
something to learn something to grow and

1772
00:59:18,069 --> 00:59:15,040
it's beautiful

1773
00:59:21,510 --> 00:59:18,079
um and i think just just

1774
00:59:24,390 --> 00:59:21,520
laugh about it move on and learn

1775
00:59:25,510 --> 00:59:24,400
and don't be afraid don't be worried and

1776
00:59:28,549 --> 00:59:25,520
encourage yourself

1777
00:59:31,270 --> 00:59:28,559
and others to fail it's part of the game

1778
00:59:31,670 --> 00:59:31,280
and it's good yeah yeah that's great i

1779
00:59:32,950 --> 00:59:31,680
mean

1780
00:59:34,870 --> 00:59:32,960
everything we do in life we have to

1781
00:59:36,710 --> 00:59:34,880
learn how to accept those failures

1782
00:59:38,150 --> 00:59:36,720
uh lena i'll give you then the final

1783
00:59:40,630 --> 00:59:38,160
words here as we're going to wrap here

1784
00:59:42,710 --> 00:59:40,640
soon uh what do you think about this and

1785
00:59:45,030 --> 00:59:42,720
feel free to add any any last bit of

1786
00:59:46,630 --> 00:59:45,040
advice as well

1787
00:59:48,230 --> 00:59:46,640
yeah i also fully agree that you you

1788
00:59:51,349 --> 00:59:48,240
have to fail sometimes

1789
00:59:51,750 --> 00:59:51,359
and i remember one of one paper of mine

1790
00:59:53,430 --> 00:59:51,760
got

1791
00:59:54,950 --> 00:59:53,440
accepted with the next three weeks it

1792
00:59:55,750 --> 00:59:54,960
was the fastest paper i ever got

1793
00:59:57,910 --> 00:59:55,760
accepted

1794
00:59:58,950 --> 00:59:57,920
this is really by now the worst paper

1795
01:00:00,549 --> 00:59:58,960
i've ever written

1796
01:00:03,030 --> 01:00:00,559
if i look at it i'm always ashamed

1797
01:00:05,030 --> 01:00:03,040
because you see the failures of being

1798
01:00:06,950 --> 01:00:05,040
rejected so being criticized

1799
01:00:08,309 --> 01:00:06,960
was missing because the riviera was too

1800
01:00:09,910 --> 01:00:08,319
too lazy i don't know

1801
01:00:11,750 --> 01:00:09,920
it's really it's not the worst player

1802
01:00:15,030 --> 01:00:11,760
i've ever written um

1803
01:00:17,109 --> 01:00:15,040
for me actually as a graduate student

1804
01:00:19,270 --> 01:00:17,119
also later as a phd student postdoc it

1805
01:00:19,829 --> 01:00:19,280
was really important for me to realize

1806
01:00:22,630 --> 01:00:19,839
that

1807
01:00:24,710 --> 01:00:22,640
everyone in science has failures to cope

1808
01:00:26,710 --> 01:00:24,720
with and even if you're

1809
01:00:28,069 --> 01:00:26,720
talking this with the boss of your boss

1810
01:00:30,470 --> 01:00:28,079
of your institute

1811
01:00:32,630 --> 01:00:30,480
everyone has papers rejected everyone

1812
01:00:34,710 --> 01:00:32,640
has purpose is rejected so it's really

1813
01:00:36,870 --> 01:00:34,720
it's it's a normal way of assigned

1814
01:00:38,390 --> 01:00:36,880
science life in a way

1815
01:00:40,710 --> 01:00:38,400
and i think this is really important to

1816
01:00:41,990 --> 01:00:40,720
keep in mind people typically tend not

1817
01:00:44,309 --> 01:00:42,000
to talk about the failures

1818
01:00:45,030 --> 01:00:44,319
but i think we should talk much more

1819
01:00:47,750 --> 01:00:45,040
about

1820
01:00:49,430 --> 01:00:47,760
how things did not work out because it

1821
01:00:51,270 --> 01:00:49,440
happens for everyone

1822
01:00:52,950 --> 01:00:51,280
yeah absolutely well this has been a

1823
01:00:54,950 --> 01:00:52,960
very fun conversation all of you

1824
01:00:57,349 --> 01:00:54,960
thank you so much all four of you for

1825
01:00:58,710 --> 01:00:57,359
joining us for ask an astrobiologist

1826
01:01:00,789 --> 01:00:58,720
i really appreciate your time and having

1827
01:01:02,390 --> 01:01:00,799
you here with us today and thanks as

1828
01:01:03,430 --> 01:01:02,400
always to our audience for watching and

1829
01:01:05,510 --> 01:01:03,440
joining us

1830
01:01:06,710 --> 01:01:05,520
uh for our call to action this month for

1831
01:01:08,950 --> 01:01:06,720
this episode

1832
01:01:12,230 --> 01:01:08,960
uh if you want to learn more about ab

1833
01:01:14,710 --> 01:01:12,240
grad con go and check out appgradcom.org

1834
01:01:16,870 --> 01:01:14,720
if you are an early career scientist uh

1835
01:01:18,789 --> 01:01:16,880
feel free to register for next year

1836
01:01:20,789 --> 01:01:18,799
the 14th through 17th of september in

1837
01:01:23,030 --> 01:01:20,799
tokyo japan

1838
01:01:25,670 --> 01:01:23,040
also if you want to learn more about the

1839
01:01:27,829 --> 01:01:25,680
past and what's gone on with abradcon

1840
01:01:29,190 --> 01:01:27,839
if you go to the nasa astrobiology

1841
01:01:32,549 --> 01:01:29,200
youtube channel

1842
01:01:35,430 --> 01:01:32,559
it's youtube.com nasa astrobiology

1843
01:01:37,430 --> 01:01:35,440
you can find playlists that archive all

1844
01:01:38,069 --> 01:01:37,440
of the talks and all of the science

1845
01:01:40,069 --> 01:01:38,079
communication

1846
01:01:42,150 --> 01:01:40,079
endeavors all of the cool events that

1847
01:01:44,789 --> 01:01:42,160
we've had at the appgrad cons

1848
01:01:46,150 --> 01:01:44,799
over these last many years uh it's a

1849
01:01:49,430 --> 01:01:46,160
great place to go

1850
01:01:50,630 --> 01:01:49,440
and check out and then finally uh if any

1851
01:01:51,990 --> 01:01:50,640
of you want to stay in the loop on

1852
01:01:53,430 --> 01:01:52,000
upcoming episodes of ask an

1853
01:01:55,270 --> 01:01:53,440
astrobiologist

1854
01:01:57,510 --> 01:01:55,280
find out more about opportunities

1855
01:02:00,470 --> 01:01:57,520
especially for early career scientists

1856
01:02:02,390 --> 01:02:00,480
from nasa astrobiology then the producer

1857
01:02:04,710 --> 01:02:02,400
and director of ask and astrobiologist

1858
01:02:06,390 --> 01:02:04,720
mike toyon is going to pop up the link

1859
01:02:08,549 --> 01:02:06,400
for signing up uh

1860
01:02:09,990 --> 01:02:08,559
for our email list so that you can join

1861
01:02:11,109 --> 01:02:10,000
us and know about when all these things

1862
01:02:13,190 --> 01:02:11,119
are going on

1863
01:02:14,829 --> 01:02:13,200
uh as always keep an eye out on all

1864
01:02:16,069 --> 01:02:14,839
social media and websites for

1865
01:02:18,309 --> 01:02:16,079
secondnet.org

1866
01:02:20,390 --> 01:02:18,319
at saginworld on twitter at nasa

1867
01:02:22,710 --> 01:02:20,400
astrobio on twitter if you'd like to

1868
01:02:23,510 --> 01:02:22,720
talk to me i'm at casmobiologist on

1869
01:02:25,190 --> 01:02:23,520
twitter

1870
01:02:26,870 --> 01:02:25,200
once again to all four of our guests

1871
01:02:28,789 --> 01:02:26,880
thank you so much for your time

1872
01:02:30,630 --> 01:02:28,799
and to our audience thanks for joining

1873
01:02:37,170 --> 01:02:30,640
and remember until next time